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BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,547
56,268
hogwash (edited to add that, don't get to use it enough)

anything that will penetrate deep enough to stop an attacker will penetrate several walls of drywall.

over-penetration is the neighbor's concern.
That statement is incorrect. It also becomes your problem when it's your stray bullets in the neighbor's house, or your kid's room.
 

Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,834
That statement is incorrect. It also becomes your problem when it's your stray bullets in the neighbor's house, or your kid's room.
know your target and what is beyond it. under-powered rounds aren't the answer.

if the round has enough energy to penetrate a clothed human and reach the central nervous system, it has enough energy to go through several walls.

The Box O' Truth #12 - Insulated Walls - The Box O' Truth

The Box O' Truth #14 - Rifles, Shotguns, and Walls - The Box O' Truth
 
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BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,547
56,268
know your target and what is beyond it. under-powered rounds aren't the answer.

if the round has enough energy to penetrate a clothed human and reach the central nervous system, it has enough energy to go through several walls.

The Box O' Truth #12 - Insulated Walls - The Box O' Truth

The Box O' Truth #14 - Rifles, Shotguns, and Walls - The Box O' Truth
Yeah, their experiments lack the most critical component of the conversation. Don't believe everything you read on the internet.
 

Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,834
Yeah, their experiments lack the most critical component of the conversation. Don't believe everything you read on the internet.
what? know where you're aiming. don't rely on under-powered rounds to compensate for what is an infinitesimally small risk.
it's simple physics. if you have enough energy in psi to go through a human sternum or skull, you have enough energy to go through a bunch of drywall
 

psychicdeath

Member
Jan 21, 2015
955
1,521
Most days I carry a Walther CCP 9 mm with 115 grain Hornady Critical Defense.



Some days when I'm wearing bulky clothes and can conceal a full size pistol more easily, I'll carry a Glock 21 .45ACP.




By the bedside I keep a Remington 870 12 gauge with 00 buckshot.
 

mysticmac

First 1025
Oct 18, 2015
14,905
17,647
My 9mms are a Glock 19 and a Glock 43. I run 115gr Speer Gold Dot.

I'd recommend checking out the ballistics test done by lucky Gunner. It is by far the most well documented study I've seen.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,547
56,268
what? know where you're aiming. don't rely on under-powered rounds to compensate for what is an infinitesimally small risk.
it's simple physics. if you have enough energy in psi to go through a human sternum or skull, you have enough energy to go through a bunch of drywall
Put an 8-10 inch thick piece of ballistic gel in front of the drywall. Then see how many sheets it'll go through.
 

Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,834
Put an 8-10 inch thick piece of ballistic gel in front of the drywall. Then see how many sheets it'll go through.
over-penetration is only a concern if you hit your target?
I think it would be more realistic to compare 'worst-case probable' than 'best-case possible'.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,547
56,268
over-penetration is only a concern if you hit your target?
I think it would be more realistic to compare 'worst-case probable' than 'best-case possible'.
Over-penetration is always a concern. But if under the absolute best case scenario, your selection will still present a myriad of issues, you're probably best to look for another solution.
 

Jdog93

.....?
Jun 2, 2016
15,419
32,863
lol I don't think he knows anything about guns he made up a a rifle called a "skal" which I assume he thought was a scar or scar-L he called it a shotgun and compared it to a p90 which fires FN's 5.7×28mm rounds.
 

Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,834
Over-penetration is always a concern. But if under the absolute best case scenario, your selection will still present a myriad of issues, you're probably best to look for another solution.
the only way to mitigate the risk of over-penetration is know your environment, establish a dominant position, and exclude areas from your field of fire. Those things are all risk vectors that you can control. How far your round penetrates is not, regardless of the round. Any round with enough power to go deep enough in to a person to stop an attack has enough power to go all the way through them, a wall, and kill someone on the other side.

However, if the person who you're trying to stop is wearing heavy cloths, is well-muscled, high on drugs, or some other factor then the under-powered round is going to be the reason they're still in the fight.

How many times in the last 10 years has someone in a home defense scenario accidentally shot someone through a wall?
Are SWAT teams rolling with .38s when they come knocking?
I just don't see any evidence that over-penetration is a meaningful or controllable risk.
 

Hauler

Been fallin so long it's like gravitys gone
Feb 3, 2016
45,413
57,814
Are SWAT teams rolling with .38s when they come knocking?
Hey! I have a .38 !!!
It's loaded with +p



I never got too concerned with the stopping power argument. Sure there are more powerful guns, but it's not like this gun won't stop an intruder. It doesn't matter if the guy is dead or super dead. Dead is dead.
 
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Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,834
Hey! I have a .38 !!!
It's loaded with +p



I never got too concerned with the stopping power argument. Sure there are more powerful guns, but it's not like this gun won't stop an intruder. It doesn't matter if the guy is dead or super dead. Dead is dead.
that's about perfect. If you haven't shot it in the dark, and without hearing protection, you probably should...just a couple rounds so you know what it's about. Most important things for home defense weapon are (IMAO) Reliable, Retainable, and Ready.

i've shot a 357 airweight, and it's got some flash and bang. That dog will bite the hand that feeds it. :)
 

Hauler

Been fallin so long it's like gravitys gone
Feb 3, 2016
45,413
57,814
that's about perfect. If you haven't shot it in the dark, and without hearing protection, you probably should...just a couple rounds so you know what it's about. Most important things for home defense weapon are (IMAO) Reliable, Retainable, and Ready.

i've shot a 357 airweight, and it's got some flash and bang. That dog will bite the hand that feeds it. :)
Yeah, it's loud as shit. Good muzzle flash.
No safety - it instead has a hard trigger pull. I prefer that instead of worrying about mags and safeties if I get surprised in the middle of the night.

My buddy says it's a poor choice because you only get 5 shots. I tell him if you need more than 5 shots you shouldn't have a gun at all.
 

Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,834
Yeah, it's loud as shit. Good muzzle flash.
No safety - it instead has a hard trigger pull. I prefer that instead of worrying about mags and safeties if I get surprised in the middle of the night.

My buddy says it's a poor choice because you only get 5 shots. I tell him if you need more than 5 shots you shouldn't have a gun at all.
my bedside/EDC is the gun that gets me to my Gun.
 

Too swole to control

I’ll fight anyone on here except Sex Chicken
Oct 28, 2015
5,879
9,590
I carry my Glock .40 everywhere I go. Bathroom, kitchen, anywhere. Also have 12 gauge JIC w a knoxx stock on hand
 
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