I just been learned.
General Pulled my kids from school 4 Remembrance Day
- Thread starter Masato Toys
- Start date
Excellent post. Would love to dig into this further with you someday.
IMHO the UK/Commonwealth/British Empire was never really seriously threatened in the buildup to WWI, the only thing that was really threatened was their total domination/stranglehold of most of global economy/trade/industry. I think a large part of WWI was not much more than the British Empire deciding to gang up and crush their growing competition and continue their dominance. Germany was building better stuff, and becoming a threat more from a business perspective than a military perspective, and they had to shut that down. Conveniently, in the process they could also take out several monarchies, make huge war profits, steroid the power of their banking systems, and basically gain even deeper control all of Europe that was previously broken up among different nations.
I also don't think that the neat thing called 'oil' was discovered 'half way through the war'. IMHO they were on to this much sooner than that, and this was another big part of it, to make sure they had control over this before anyone else did.
Its a super interesting war, definitely a myriad of causes, but ultimately this is what it breaks down to imho. I also find it interesting that the Federal Reserve was created just months before the start of the war. That's a whole other chapter.
I have a super busy day today I have to stay offline but I'd love to talk history with you more someday. I am not here to argue just share and learn. For sure I am still missing lots of the puzzle, if we can talk with civility I am super open to being called out on my errors.
Thanks, have a great day.
Thanks for clarifying
Agreed, from the perspectives of the soldiers and what they thought they were fighting for, they were unfathomable heroes and deserve all the respect in the world. I just can't seem to bridge the gap between what they THOUGHT they were fighting for, and what it seems they were actually fighting for. They thought they were fighting for good, but the more I learn the more I believe they were unsuspectingly fighting for some real evil shit.
I prefer to build my history and teach my kids history based on the facts, not sentiment. Telling them that the soldiers thought they were fighting for us, our future, our freedom etc is true. Telling them that this is what they actually fought for however imo is not. I think this is a really important distinction to make.
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Dude I lament the loss of your friend. That is hard. I too have casualties from Afghanistan, my cousin went and got right fucked up.My childhood friend lost his life in Afghanistan.
You're welcome.
But if I may humbly ask, what exactly are you thanking them for? What do you think their service in Afghanistan did for Canadians, or Canada? This is sort of my point of the thread, examining the idea that their service/sacrifice was for us, that they sacrificed somehow for our benefit. I followed the War on Terror since day 1 and still fail to see how anything in Afghanistan had anything to do with 'serving our country'.
Apologies if any of this sounds disrespectful, it is not my intention. I just have a lot of trouble with what I perceive to be a huge gap between the sentiment and rhetoric of thanking troops for what they did for us, and the reality of who I think they actually sacrificed themselves for. Hence my issues with Remembrance Day
My friend and I met as teens working for a summer camp for children who would otherwise have been unable to attend camp due to family/life/financial circumstances. From a young age he always wanted to serve and help others. We often talked about what we wanted to do as we got older and it involved helping people.
For my friend it was joining the military but not just to fight but to help people in other countries as a peace keeper which was a well known role for Canada. In short he joined up to fight to stop fighting.
He also was really big on going into disaster areas when sent by the gov't to help people out IN Canada who had just had floods, fires, etc and had just lost everything.
What did he do for Canada? He went places as our representative and did things our country, and we as the people who elected our leaders, requested him to do.
He spent time in dangerous foreign places ensuring that peace continued so that children would have the chance to grow up and hopefully know these can be a difference rather than trying to kill others. So that places where oppression and cruelty openly ruled, were met with the only force they would understand and give the people suffering there a chance to live without that hovering over their heads. He and others gave them that chance and opportunity.
He went places where Canadians lost everything and helped them survive and let them know that Canadian people and also their gov't did care and were there to help.
He didn't do it for money. If you know anyone in the military you know that isn't there. He did it for pride. He did it to help others. He did it because he loved this country and he loved representing what we as a people can and should be when we think of ourselves and what others think of when they hear our name.
He represented Canada and the beliefs, hopes, and dreams that we have as a country at home and on the world stage and he paid the ultimate price for what we asked him to do.
I don't think that one day where we ask people to think of all the men and women who have given the most precious thing they have when asked by their country is too much to ask for him. I think of him randomly a lot and I enjoy that I can spend time each year wearing my poppy so I can be proud of him.
It doesn't have to be how others say it should be done. You can do it your own way. If taking your child out of school and spending the day talking about war(s), peace keeping, what soldiers do and what they sacrifice is how you choose to remember them, great. Most ceremonies are just there so people who don't know what to do have the chance to do something and also so current vets can be thanked for service.
I myself do not attend any service. I wait until the evening and then go to a cenotaph and spend some time thinking about him, things I am doing in my life, and if I am really living my life in a manner I want others to remember me by. Then I write his name on the back of the poppy and leave it there. His death inspired me to do volunteer work for a military-style gov't service which I do all year round.
Whatever you do, I think it should be done out of respect for the soldiers, not for political reasons. Whatever their reasons for going, whatever the political issues behind it, they went and did something that we should thank them for in their service. Understand that rallying against foolish decisions of old gov'ts by rallying against a day meant for the soldier, not the gov't, demeans their work and sacrifice.
When people say we shouldn't have Remembrance Day, or it's a joke, or that they get angry at politics rather than use the day to thank servicemen, I know for me, I will continue to use the day as I think it was meant and no one can stop me. My friend died for the idea he was making a difference and so that we as a country and as a people would have the freedom to agree or disagree, to practice our lives in whatever manner we want.
He died for that idea, and while many can try to corrupt an idea, the idea remains because of people like my friend. In our national anthem it says, "We stand on guard, for thee." I stand on guard for my friend, his idea of this country, and the freedom we have as a result of people willing to give everything to try and make here and the world a better place.
So I say "you're welcome" because I know that was what my friend would say if people said "thank you" for his service and sacrifice.
Brent Donald Poland - The Canadian Virtual War Memorial - Veterans Affairs Canada
For my friend it was joining the military but not just to fight but to help people in other countries as a peace keeper which was a well known role for Canada. In short he joined up to fight to stop fighting.
He also was really big on going into disaster areas when sent by the gov't to help people out IN Canada who had just had floods, fires, etc and had just lost everything.
What did he do for Canada? He went places as our representative and did things our country, and we as the people who elected our leaders, requested him to do.
He spent time in dangerous foreign places ensuring that peace continued so that children would have the chance to grow up and hopefully know these can be a difference rather than trying to kill others. So that places where oppression and cruelty openly ruled, were met with the only force they would understand and give the people suffering there a chance to live without that hovering over their heads. He and others gave them that chance and opportunity.
He went places where Canadians lost everything and helped them survive and let them know that Canadian people and also their gov't did care and were there to help.
He didn't do it for money. If you know anyone in the military you know that isn't there. He did it for pride. He did it to help others. He did it because he loved this country and he loved representing what we as a people can and should be when we think of ourselves and what others think of when they hear our name.
He represented Canada and the beliefs, hopes, and dreams that we have as a country at home and on the world stage and he paid the ultimate price for what we asked him to do.
I don't think that one day where we ask people to think of all the men and women who have given the most precious thing they have when asked by their country is too much to ask for him. I think of him randomly a lot and I enjoy that I can spend time each year wearing my poppy so I can be proud of him.
It doesn't have to be how others say it should be done. You can do it your own way. If taking your child out of school and spending the day talking about war(s), peace keeping, what soldiers do and what they sacrifice is how you choose to remember them, great. Most ceremonies are just there so people who don't know what to do have the chance to do something and also so current vets can be thanked for service.
I myself do not attend any service. I wait until the evening and then go to a cenotaph and spend some time thinking about him, things I am doing in my life, and if I am really living my life in a manner I want others to remember me by. Then I write his name on the back of the poppy and leave it there. His death inspired me to do volunteer work for a military-style gov't service which I do all year round.
Whatever you do, I think it should be done out of respect for the soldiers, not for political reasons. Whatever their reasons for going, whatever the political issues behind it, they went and did something that we should thank them for in their service. Understand that rallying against foolish decisions of old gov'ts by rallying against a day meant for the soldier, not the gov't, demeans their work and sacrifice.
When people say we shouldn't have Remembrance Day, or it's a joke, or that they get angry at politics rather than use the day to thank servicemen, I know for me, I will continue to use the day as I think it was meant and no one can stop me. My friend died for the idea he was making a difference and so that we as a country and as a people would have the freedom to agree or disagree, to practice our lives in whatever manner we want.
He died for that idea, and while many can try to corrupt an idea, the idea remains because of people like my friend. In our national anthem it says, "We stand on guard, for thee." I stand on guard for my friend, his idea of this country, and the freedom we have as a result of people willing to give everything to try and make here and the world a better place.
So I say "you're welcome" because I know that was what my friend would say if people said "thank you" for his service and sacrifice.
Brent Donald Poland - The Canadian Virtual War Memorial - Veterans Affairs Canada