General Bernie unveils student debt cancellation bill

Welcome to our Community
Wanting to join the rest of our members? Feel free to Sign Up today.
Sign up

Hauler

Been fallin so long it's like gravitys gone
Feb 3, 2016
45,412
57,814
Rather than bail these people out of their debt, I think we'd be better suited to financially educate people at a younger age so they understad how loans work. Financial responsibility is something that is largely missing from today's society. Paying off their commitments does nothing but perpetuate that problem.

I don't agree with it when the government bails out companies and I have the same mindset when it comes to individuals. You signed the line. You made the decision. Own it.
 

Hauler

Been fallin so long it's like gravitys gone
Feb 3, 2016
45,412
57,814
Legit question...

Isn't free education the military's favorite carrot? What will they use to incentivize enrollment if free college education becomes a thing?
 

Hauler

Been fallin so long it's like gravitys gone
Feb 3, 2016
45,412
57,814
Its a priority to the economy to have a "progressive" continuing education system that's very low cost
Why? So they can prolong the real world for 4 more years?

If it's a tradeschool or something that actually helps our society improve our workforce, I support it. But to have the taxpayers pick up the dime on a 4 year Art History degree? No.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,547
56,268
Higher education is a right imo and just like in primary education people can do well or fail almost free of charge at the tax payers expense

Its a priority to the economy to have a "progressive" continuing education system that's very low cost
Primary education was devised by the government as a way to create compliant, obedient citizens.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,547
56,268
1) There are multiple ways to accomplish that goal. (See: Australia)

2) The goal of the public school system at its inception was literally to create "good" citizens. There's a reason the government controls what's taught and why critical thinking isn't one of those things
 

regular john

Muay Thai World Champion
May 21, 2015
5,043
6,628
Bernie obviously doesn't expect this bill to pass it exactly the way it's proposed. You aim high and hit in the middle.

The democrats and left leaners all around the world just absolutely need to make noise and balance out the far right/extreme conservatives' perverse agenda of turning the world into a private stock market. The western world was built on progressive philosophy and welfare state policy. Every 30-40 years or so people go into a reactionary frenzy but extreme fiscal policies just make things worse.
 

kneeblock

Drapetomaniac
Apr 18, 2015
12,435
23,026
That's not true. Hes suggesting 1.6 trillion now and then all free college in the future.
Total Bill is markedly higher than that.
It also risk upending the quality of our university education system.
You will have to add regulation once you introduce cost controls.

A better system would be subsidizing schools (not students) that meet intended outcomes. our entire problem is subsidizing the student to chase the same product with more dollars.
Then we should link payback to income as a debt cancellation measure.

Only 12% of The students make up more than half of all of the debt.




From the lying New York times...





The student loan "crisis" is because people borrowed money and then didn't get a degree.
Those that graduated don't often have a problem and made a good investment. If they aren't paying off their loan it's usually their fault as they make enough income to do so.

Bernie always wants to centralize in federalize everything. The plan is always more entitlements with more money. Everything free and centralized. this should be looked at with caution as there's no going back once you create such a large behemoth.

Loan repayments linked to income for some max perios, automatically deducted from paychecks protects the taxpayer and keeps some skin in the game for the borrower
This is all wrong, but I don't have time to comment til later tonight because I'm traveling. Way to push the bootstraps ideology though.
 

Splinty

Shake 'em off
Admin
Dec 31, 2014
44,116
91,095
This is all wrong, but I don't have time to comment til later tonight because I'm traveling. Way to push the bootstraps ideology though.

I'm not pushing the bootstraps and I sourced a national level paper with the fact that it is outliers, not the median, that cant pay their loans.

Rich kids don't need help. Middle class kids usually don't. Poor kids usually do and are also the most likely to not complete their degree, saddling them with debt and no skills. And with poor comes minority students most likely defaulting in these outlier amounts.

Another...

These are the students most crushed by the debt crisis


The student loan problem is yet another example of resources natural propensity to accumulate. Poor kids take bigger loans make worse decisions more likely to drop out more likely to default.
Rich kids take smaller loans more likely to graduate get a high income job pay off their loans.

What in that description sounds like bootstrapping it?

The reality is that the median amounts owed for those that graduate is not so high that they can't pay it off.

It is a minority of outliers that graduate with huge debt and people that do not graduate that can't pay their loans.

I have espoused plans that would continue payments and then forgive after some period of time. Such a plan would only benefit those outliers with abnormal high loan amounts and those that did not graduate. Those that took the usual loan and graduated and went to work would be able to pay off their debt. If I'm suggesting helping to cover those stuck in a debt cycle how is that bootstrapping? I also suggested holding schools accountable and not have the taxpayer guaranteeing bad loans, which includes not having the taxpayer guaranteeing loans to private for profit schools.
 

Never_Rolled

First 10,000
Dec 17, 2018
5,798
6,349
I'm not pushing the bootstraps and I sourced a national level paper with the fact that it is outliers, not the median, that cant pay their loans.

Rich kids don't need help. Middle class kids usually don't. Poor kids usually do and are also the most likely to not complete their degree, saddling them with debt and no skills. And with poor comes minority students most likely defaulting in these outlier amounts.

Another...

These are the students most crushed by the debt crisis


The student loan problem is yet another example of resources natural propensity to accumulate. Poor kids take bigger loans make worse decisions more likely to drop out more likely to default.
Rich kids take smaller loans more likely to graduate get a high income job pay off their loans.

What in that description sounds like bootstrapping it?

The reality is that the median amounts owed for those that graduate is not so high that they can't pay it off.

It is a minority of outliers that graduate with huge debt and people that do not graduate that can't pay their loans.

I have espoused plans that would continue payments and then forgive after some period of time. Such a plan would only benefit those outliers with abnormal high loan amounts and those that did not graduate. Those that took the usual loan and graduated and went to work would be able to pay off their debt. If I'm suggesting helping to cover those stuck in a debt cycle how is that bootstrapping? I also suggested holding schools accountable and not have the taxpayer guaranteeing bad loans, which includes not having the taxpayer guaranteeing loans to private for profit schools.
When he posts a War and Peace length answer it will be on you. You just had to poke the bear right?
 

Never_Rolled

First 10,000
Dec 17, 2018
5,798
6,349
Slightly off topic but interesting Hillsdale College does not take students with Gov. backed loans so they don’t have to abide by Title 9 rules. Interesting policy. They’re a small conservative school. Mainly they feel affirmative action is a racist policy.

I had a German friend who was teaching German at Yale for a couple years. Yes he’s a smug liberal. He was making fun of them at a professor job fair. He loved teaching and Yale. Even got into firearms but hated the ghetto that surrounds Yale and moved back to Germany.
 

Never_Rolled

First 10,000
Dec 17, 2018
5,798
6,349
Real question... How's this going to work in the debt cancellation plan ?


View: https://mobile.twitter.com/thehill/status/1143215977099907072


Four year degree cost $250,000. Student really really wants to go there. Is that a good reason for us as taxpayers to bear that cost and risk?
It depends which side of the isle you ask.

This is the mindset of many on the left. I realize this was about healthcare but mindset. The gov will take care of it don't worry. You don't need to be responsible. Just do whatever suits you.
 
Last edited:

Toelocku

*I Know What I Know if you Know What I Mean*
Dec 15, 2018
5,694
4,969
Why? So they can prolong the real world for 4 more years?

If it's a tradeschool or something that actually helps our society improve our workforce, I support it. But to have the taxpayers pick up the dime on a 4 year Art History degree? No.
Why do you hate art history?
 

Toelocku

*I Know What I Know if you Know What I Mean*
Dec 15, 2018
5,694
4,969
decisions aren't consequences, because words have meanings.

and we can't afford anything, we're in debt.
Yes words do have meanings and as I said bad decisions are a learning experience/consequence

Enslaving young people to a lifetime of usurious interest should be illegal

We definitely can afford it if we taxed properly and didn't spend stupidly
 
Last edited:

Toelocku

*I Know What I Know if you Know What I Mean*
Dec 15, 2018
5,694
4,969