General Canadian Politics eh.

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LOL. I actually had to check if Ontario is considered a “have” province again or still a “have not”. It changes so often. Look up the last time that Alberta took an equalization payment and you might start to understand the grumbling.

Don’t tell Albertans, but Ontario is benefiting from a big loophole in the equalization formula
I lived in Alberta for 8 years, I know how it is. But Ontario isn’t your enemy on this.

Ontario was the last province to ever claim an equalization payment. It is still a huge engine of the Canadian economy despite the tough times it’s experiencing. Most years, even when a have not province, Ontarians still contributed more than they got back.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

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Jul 22, 2015
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We should have, but we didn’t.


Alberta gives more than it gets from federal government: Fraser Institute

“Alberta contributed more money to the federal purse than any other province in Canada from 2007 to 2015, and has received fewer dollars in return, according to a study released Thursday.“


“In the midst of the oil boom, between 2004 and 2014, the report said Alberta created 32.5 per cent of all private sector jobs in the country, despite “having only 11.7 per cent of the country’s population.”

Just two years ago, in 2015, the report said Albertans paid about 63 per cent more in federal tax dollars than other Canadians.

Without revenue from Alberta, the report claims Ottawa would have seen big deficits every year since 2009.

“We’ve got a pretty big deficit this year… Without Alberta’s big contribution, that’s about twice as big,” Eisen said.”
That money went to the government. The plebs didn't get anything other than gas doubling in price over a short period.

and to be fair, Alberta probably shouldn't be complaining too much. Everyone knows Newfoundland is the rightful owner of all that oil.
 

Freeloading Rusty

Here comes Rover, sniffin’ at your ass
Jan 11, 2016
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Premier John Horgan opens door to including dental coverage within B.C.’s health care system
“We have been looking at it and hopefully we will be able to do something about it in the next budget,” Horgan said.
The fact basic dental care is not funded is a joke. Good on the NDP if they manage to include this in the upcoming budget.

Between this and the current movement towards affordable childcare, NDP is making strides to help the working class in BC.

B.C. government announces 439 new child care spaces in Greater Victoria
Duncan’s Parkside Academy chosen for universal day-care pilot project - Cowichan Valley Citizen
Providing $10-per-day child-care spaces across the province had been one of the NDP government’s major election promises.

The prototype plan to make it a reality was announced in November and includes spaces for about 2,500 children at 53 child-care facilities, including Parkside Academy, in both rural and urban areas around the province.

All were expected to be in operation by Dec. 1, and cost parents and guardians a maximum of $200 a month per child.
The chosen sites will operate until March 31, 2020, and are required to provide the government with feedback on the program to prepare for an eventual province-wide rollout.
 
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DiSmAnTLeR

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Apr 5, 2016
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That money went to the government. The plebs didn't get anything other than gas doubling in price over a short period.

and to be fair, Alberta probably shouldn't be complaining too much. Everyone knows Newfoundland is the rightful owner of all that oil.
The money went East and disappeared. That’s the long and short of it. We figured out long ago, how Quebec can offer daycare for as low as $7 a day, or afford to plow empty streets when Alberta citys are over their snow clearing budget before Christmas.


View: https://youtu.be/SWzbEn-aXMQ


(Newfies usually only stick around until they get enough hours to draw EI)
 

DiSmAnTLeR

Well-Known Member
Apr 5, 2016
906
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I lived in Alberta for 8 years, I know how it is. But Ontario isn’t your enemy on this.

Ontario was the last province to ever claim an equalization payment. It is still a huge engine of the Canadian economy despite the tough times it’s experiencing. Most years, even when a have not province, Ontarians still contributed more than they got back.

Alberta hasnt received an equalization payment since the 1950’s. Our GDP is almost half of Ontario’s with less than a third of the population. Every time Ontario goes back on the tit, Alberta is the one getting squeezed.


View: https://youtu.be/YQM6kfw6bSo
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
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The money went East and disappeared. That’s the long and short of it. We figured out long ago, how Quebec can offer daycare for as low as $7 a day, or afford to plow empty streets when Alberta citys are over their snow clearing budget before Christmas.
Is snow clearing in Alberta run by the province? In Ontario snow clearing is funded by the municipality. We'll also see plows out when they don't need to be. Wasteful as all fuck, but it's what you come to expect with how governments do budgets.
 

DiSmAnTLeR

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Snow clearing is ran at the provincial and municipal level. The municipal governments, of course, receive provincial and federal funding to supplement taxation for their operations. The point that I was making is that Albertans realize that we are getting a raw deal when as a ‘have’ province, we somehow go over budget with an early snowfall and Quebec can afford to run theirh) equipment when the roads are clear. Eventually, people will equate it to the billions that we give them.

Ultimately, every level of government in every province benefits from Alberta oil revenue, either directly or indirectly.
Ontario pulls some weight for sure. A quick look at the equalization payout numbers will tell you that. They have taken a lot less than some provinces. They are at least a contributor at times.

Alberta is a hyper-contributor and the very provinces receiving their generosity, undermine the industry that enables that generosity in an effort to virtue signal to the world.

'Dirty' oil finances Quebec's schools, hospitals, Alberta reminds Legault
 

DiSmAnTLeR

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Apr 5, 2016
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“despite posting a budgetary surplus, Quebec would receive the lion’s share of federal transfer payments for 2019-2020 — more than $13 billion.“


“Alberta, considered a rich province when it comes to equalization eligibility, complains it is going through an economic crisis because of the weak price for oil. The Notley government is forecasting a $7.5-billion deficit for the current financial year.“

We are going in debt in order to finance another province that is running a surplus and trying to encourage consumers to purchase their hydro energy, which is exempt from equalization payment schemes, instead of our oil. They are killing Canada’s cash cow in an blatant effort to steal Alberta’s market.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
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Snow clearing is ran at the provincial and municipal level. The municipal governments, of course, receive provincial and federal funding to supplement taxation for their operations.
This is correct, buy municipalities have their own places where the money is or isn't used. Quebec may be using equalization payments to pay for snow removal, but theres a good chance they aren't.

Regarding the rest of your post there isn't really a conversation to be had as I don't disagree with you. Personally, I don't think we should have nearly as many social programs as we do. It'd alleviate a lot of the revenue bickering.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

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Jul 22, 2015
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Do you think that this is the point that I was trying to convey?
I think you were trying to convey that by in large part Quebec is a wasteful, cesspool or corruption.

The point of my post was that when inaccurate examples of their waste are used it undermines the overall point you're illustrating.
 

DiSmAnTLeR

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Apr 5, 2016
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I think you were trying to convey that by in large part Quebec is a wasteful, cesspool or corruption.

The point of my post was that when inaccurate examples of their waste are used it undermines the overall point you're illustrating.
No. I was not trying convey that Quebec is a wasteful cesspool of corruption. In fact, I wasn’t speaking about corruption at all. The point that I was trying to convey is that Albertans feel ripped off transferring wealth for resources extracted from our provinces, when we are struggling to provide services that other provinces seem to have no issue providing to the point of excess.

I really don’t know how to have a productive discussion if you are going to misconstrue what I am saying.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

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Jul 22, 2015
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I really don’t know how to have a productive discussion if you are going to misconstrue what I am saying.
Try using more accurate examples?

The point that I was trying to convey is that Albertans feel ripped off transferring wealth for resources extracted from our provinces, when we are struggling to provide services that other provinces seem to have no issue providing to the point of excess.
Every province feels ripped off, and every province struggles to provide.
 

Freeloading Rusty

Here comes Rover, sniffin’ at your ass
Jan 11, 2016
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PCs delay controversial appointment of OPP chief while selection is reviewed | CBC News
The Ontario government said Saturday it will "respect" a request from the incoming OPP commissioner to delay his appointment while the province's integrity commissioner reviews the circumstances of his selection.

Toronto police Supt. Ron Taverner, a 51-year veteran of the force and long-time family friend of Premier Doug Ford, was named as the next OPP commissioner last month. He was set to be appointed on Monday.
 

DiSmAnTLeR

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Apr 5, 2016
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Try using more accurate examples?



Every province feels ripped off, and every province struggles to provide.

It doesn’t matter how accurate my examples are when you are going to twist them into a topic that I didn’t even address (corruption). You are either intentionally or unintentionally not following along if that is what you got from my posts. I used to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume it was unintentional, but you seem smarter than that.

Every province struggles to provide but one province in particular has been punching above its weight class, while providing for others.

“Such occasional wrinkles aside though, the data shows that, as a percentage of GDP, taxpayers in three provinces contribute more in revenues than is later spent by the federal government: Albertans contribute more (by 6.1 percentage points) Ontarians contribute more (by 3.8 points) and British Columbians contribute more (by 1.7 points).” (Consider that Alberta has 4 million people, Ontario has 14 million people)

For the record, my example is very accurate. Quebec uses equalization money to finance their provincial government, which provides snow clearing and also subsidizes their municipal governments with that same money. There is no way that they aren’t using equalization payments for that funding. “ In 2009, equalization payments revenue was equivalent to 42% of the amount of revenues from Quebec’s consumption taxes and almost as much as Quebec paid in interest on it’s debt that year.”

Quebec doesn’t necessarily take the equalization payment and put it in an account marked “snow clearing” but there isn’t a road being paved, driven on, or cleared of snow in Quebec that isn’t subsidized by equalization payments. In fact, there isn’t a level of government in Quebec not dependent on the money at this point, which is why it was recently increased.

Is Quebec subsidized by the rest of Canada?: op-ed

“In dollar terms, the 2000 to 2009 average shows that Albertans lost the most, with a net loss of $3,852 per person annually in the federal taxing/spending equation. (British Columbians lose $666 per person and the figure in Ontario is $1,548.) Quebecois are net gainers, with $730 per person to the good, while Prince Edward Islanders have won the lottery, with $5,838 in federal spending per person, in their favour.

So Prince Edward Island (and other provinces in Atlantic Canada) is indeed more dependent on federal transfers than Quebec when measured per person. And the $730 per person balance in Quebec’s favour may not seem like much but in 2009, Prince Edward Island had just 140,000 people; Quebec had over 7.8 million people—or 56 times as many as Prince Edward Island.

That much larger Quebec population matters a lot to Albertans, British Columbians and Ontarians who finance Quebec’s provincial government. In 2009, those population figures mean there was a $5.7 billion net federal transfer to Quebec. (In contrast, PEI’s net transfers cost the rest of Canada $817 million.)

Perhaps Quebec can live without $5.7 billion every year (a number likely higher now), but in 2009, that was already equivalent to 42 per cent of the amount of revenues from Quebec’s consumption taxes ($13.5 billion) and almost as much as Quebec paid in interest on its debt that year ($6.2 billion).

That raises the question of how an independent Quebec would pay for any revenue loss. Last time, I checked, Quebec was not undertaxed. Regardless, no one, least of all anyone in Quebec, should buy the myth Quebec isn’t massively subsidized by the rest of Canada. It surely is.”
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
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It doesn’t matter how accurate my examples are when you are going to twist them into a topic that I didn’t even address (corruption). You are either intentionally or unintentionally not following along if that is what you got from my posts. I used to give you the benefit of the doubt and assume it was unintentional, but you seem smarter than that.
If you believe that Quebec’s spending habits and corruption aren't directly tied, there's no discussion to be had.
 

Banchan

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Oct 2, 2017
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How is it corruption if the parties involved are the ones who put the brakes on it?
If it seemed like the investigation would see that he would continue into the position of Commissioner, do you think he would ask that they give his old job back? He obviously knows there's a good chance he wont get it now.

They put the brakes after Brad Blair proceeded legal action after the privacy commisioner felt he couldn't intervene and Howrath made a big deal about it. Before blair blew the whistle, ford was telling everyone to buzz off.
 
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BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
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If it seemed like the investigation would see that he would continue into the position of Commisi9ner, do you think he would ask that they give his old job back?
Yes. It makes for great optics.

Blair, who has now guaranteed he won't get the job, complained. The official opposition complained (as they should have) So the PC's postpone the offer and Taverner stays at his post until the process runs. A few months from now (or less) when everything is forgotten. They'll say "the review came back fine, and he's good to go." At that point the corruption crowd won't have a leg to stand on because Taverner and the PC's will have jumped through all their hoops. Conversely, if they come back and say it was fucked up, he can't have the job. Taverner and the PC's get credit for not going through with it.
 

Banchan

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Oct 2, 2017
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Taverner is an old man with old man views and needs to retire. He apparently hushed females from trying to make complaints about sexual harassment against their superiors in TPS. The swamp needs to be emptied and he's one of the slimey scum that needs to go.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
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Taverner is an old man with old man views and needs to retire. He apparently hushed females from trying to make complaints about sexual harassment against their superiors in TPS. The swamp needs to be emptied and he's one of the slimey scum that needs to go.
Okay?