Cat Zingano goes in on UFC Athletes Retreat

[Wild]

One person who understood why the retreat was happening but saw it largely as a backfire was Cat Zingano, who couldn’t help but see the lapses in logic.

“I could see the effort, right, the effort in trying to get us to bond,” she told MMA Fighting. “In one way, it was super-awkward getting everybody to be in one place at the same time.

“The one thing that I worried about was the content of the seminar. It was hard to watch because I was like, do these people believe what they’re saying, and they just don’t know? Or are they aware, and it’s a show? I want to say that every single one of us at least, I don’t know how many times that weekend, were looking at each other rolling our eyes. But also all of us in the fear of, we don’t even get to do anything about this. Part of me felt like there was a highlight video being created, Ultimate Fighter style, where they’re saying the stuff they’re saying on stage and then they edit in us laughing and smiling.”

Such was the vibe in play last weekend in Las Vegas. The retreat featured speaking engagements by the five-time NBA champion Bryant, who talked about investing money, as well as the NFL’s Strahan. There were talks about the UFC sponsor Reebok, and a Budweiser representative also gave a pep talk of sorts.

Many of the fighters in attendance were in the mid-to-lower-tier pay range, with only three total UFC champions having flown in — Amanda Nunes, Demetrious Johnson and Tyron Woodley. And one of the complaints coming out of the weekend was that there was a feeling of disconnect between the fighter reality and the one being presented to them.

Zingano said that many of the fighters felt at times invaded and “a little insulted.”

“If this retreat was meant to tell us about all the newness that is happening, not only the millions of dollars that they probably spent on this event, and the carpets at the event that will be used once, and wall fixture that will be used once, and how much money went into bringing Snoop in and Michael Strahan in, and Kobe Bryant — what did these guys get paid to come do this?” she said. “When we’re sitting here broke, or struggling. Or the people that are still on top in the world are wondering what they’re going to do next in their career.

“It was really hard for me personally seeing how they’re throwing out all these companies making all this money, and we should be honored to be considered on the same level of popularity of these companies.”

It’s this last part that piqued Zingano, and she said many of her fellow fighters.

“That was more insulting than anything, and I don’t know if they considered that when they were creating the content, when they were like look, we get this many viewers, we sell this many fights to this many homes a year, blah blah blah, and all of us are still sitting there knowing exactly what we get f*cking paid,” Zingano said.

“How much is Kobe getting to be there? And I love the man. Don’t get me wrong, I love Michael Strahan. Michael Strahan is actually one of the producers that did my documentary [Religion of Sports], so I have an invested emotion in actually liking this guy because he was delicate with my situation and my story. I do care about these guys, but it’s like, how much did it cost to get them there? How much did it cost for Snoop to be there for a private concert? And every carpet in this hotel saying ‘Fighter Retreat?’ Why not spread that money out over us? Or get us health insurance? We’re getting welcomed to a family, this professional athlete family, a world family. Kobe’s telling us how to invest our money. Tell me how do I invest and intelligently get a return on f*cking five thousand dollars?

“I don’t feel they were considering at all our positions.”

Zingano on UFC retreat: ‘I don’t feel like they were considering our positions’

 

[Mishima Zaibatsu]

Well said.

Why waste that money on these things when the fighters are living on less than 20k a fight most of the time.

 

[Limpy]

Who the fuck is Kobe telling to invest their money properly? WME?

Yeah, make sure you're smart with your $20,000 not guaranteed salary.

I hope that retreat backfires even more. What a bunch of shit.

 

[mmadotcomisufcdotcom]

Exactly. Said it in the Kobe thread. These fighters cannot relate to Kobe and having him there to talk to the athletes about money was fucking insulting.

I would bet if fighters had an option, a good chunk of them would have ripped there comtracts up at that event and walked out after being pissed on.

 

[TheEmperorRises]

It's fitting that the UFC used to be owned and run by casino owners, because that is very much how they treat their fighters. They dangle a carrot in front of fighters, but so few ever get it. "Look how much Conor makes! Keep winning fights and maybe someday you'll make that too!!" So fighters gamble, hoping to win big one day.

But the house always wins.

 

[ShakaSway]

WME are kinda in the same situation Reebok was in when they joined the UFC familiy, nonetheless being the new papas, if you will.

They misunderstood the fighters, followed up by the shitstorm.

Sounds more like a end of school assembly than anything else. Patronizing.

 

[Yossarian]

They have no idea what they bought.

 

[KWingJitsu]

Can't wait till Viacom buys them out....

 

[sgotwalks]

That was a fantastic article. I've always liked Cat, and now I like her even more!

 

[kneeblock]

Highlight of the article:

Perhaps nothing embodied Zingano’s frustration with the proceedings quite like the 50 percent off coupon from Reebok fighters were given, as part of an attendee gift pack....

“They gave us these boxes, these UFC boxes, which had shoes and sweatpants or something in it,” she said. “On the bottom of the box, it had this coupon, and I pick up the coupon when I got home. Someone had said while we were there, dude, f*ck all of this, how are they sitting here educating us about Reebok when Reebok is already taking all of our money? Everyone’s upset about it, that we lost so much money, lost any credit with any sponsors ever.

“So I get home and I find that thing on the bottom of the box, and I was like — so, this is really what I’ve worked this hard for? This is me, I’ve made it, I’m one of the best in the world at something, I’ve f*cking made it — and this is what I get from the company that took all my money, is they want more?”

 

[Yossarian]

Everyone’s upset about it, that we lost so much money, lost any credit with any sponsors ever.

This right here. Fighters lost a lot of value due to the Reebok deal. A forced low compensation, that pushed down the value of fighter exposure. Another side-effect of the deal. Is that why Rory McDonald has a hard time getting a deal? Or some of the other fighters coming from the UFC? Does that also serve as another detereent for fighters that want to go to seemingly greener pastures? Lots of (rhetorical) questions.

Another factor is that their individuality was taken away, a valuable factor in self marketin, especially in their most crucial moment, the fight. Everytime I think a union is a bad thing, the Reebok thing reminds me otherwise.

 

[Clappin'Daddys]

This right here. Fighters lost a lot of value due to the Reebok deal. A forced low compensation, that pushed down the value of fighter exposure. Another side-effect of the deal. Is that why Rory McDonald has a hard time getting a deal? Or some of the other fighters coming from the UFC? Does that also serve as another detereent for fighters that want to go to seemingly greener pastures? Lots of (rhetorical) questions.

Another factor is that their individuality was taken away, a valuable factor in self marketin, especially in their most crucial moment, the fight. Everytime I think a union is a bad thing, the Reebok thing reminds me otherwise.

This is a good point. It's humorous when I see other posters smugly and sarcastically saying "but but he can make a killing on sponsorship now lmfao"

It's logical that with the sponsorship tax, then the reebok deal, the UFC gutted a large portion of the sponsorship market. They purposefully hammered the sponsor market at their fighters expense, to benefit only themselves. It'll take a while for sponsorship to recover(if it ever does)

That said though, it's up to the competing orgs and their fighters to make the most out of sponsorships. To create a platform that sponsors deem worth throwing money at.

To me, reebok deal vs free sponsorship market is pretty much socialism vs capitalism. One is guaranteed pay, but with the bar set low. You will always get your money, but you won't get a lot of it.

The other is the freedom to succeed and the freedom to fail. It's much more uncertain, but the potential rewards could be huge.

It all comes down to what the fighter prefers

 

[1031]

Highlight of the article:

Perhaps nothing embodied Zingano’s frustration with the proceedings quite like the 50 percent off coupon from Reebok fighters were given, as part of an attendee gift pack....

“They gave us these boxes, these UFC boxes, which had shoes and sweatpants or something in it,” she said. “On the bottom of the box, it had this coupon, and I pick up the coupon when I got home. Someone had said while we were there, dude, f*ck all of this, how are they sitting here educating us about Reebok when Reebok is already taking all of our money? Everyone’s upset about it, that we lost so much money, lost any credit with any sponsors ever.

“So I get home and I find that thing on the bottom of the box, and I was like — so, this is really what I’ve worked this hard for? This is me, I’ve made it, I’m one of the best in the world at something, I’ve f*cking made it — and this is what I get from the company that took all my money, is they want more?”

I feel like this really encapsulates what's wrong with the world today. Pure unadulterated greed. That means zero empathy and sympathy for anyone else. And my feeling is that it wouldn't matter who was in charge 7/10.

It's impossible to pin the blame on just one or two people when it looks like it's everyone who's corporate or whose office is not gym who is prepared to throw the fighters under the bus for a little bit more. They need a union, there's no way they'll ever get better treatment as a whole without a union. They could actually sit out for 3-6 months maximum and either the UFC goes bankrupt or they get a better deal.

Can someone tell me why they haven't organized a union yet?

 

[Chromium]

Can someone tell me why they haven't organized a union yet?

I can't say for sure, but

1) Fighters can't legally form a union since they're not employees (even though they're treated like employees). They're independent contractors. They can, however, form a fighter's association, which accomplishes roughly the same thing.

2) However, it's an absolutely Herculean task to organize hundreds of fighters when they live all over the world. I know a majority train in North America, but still.

3) The fighters with the most influence over the UFC, the ones at the type like McGregor or Jones, those are the ones with the most to lose. A major player or five will have to fall on their swords.

4) Anything organizational effort that's effective is usually not going to announce themselves on Twitter ahead of time. So if Leslie Smith is out there networking with people, trying to connect everyone to everyone else, she'd be smart to not speak of it until she has a fairly huge number of people committed. That takes a lot of time. But if we hear something six months from now, a year from now, three years from now, the best case scenario is that the UFC gets totally blindsided and 150+ fighters on the roster come out and form a united front all at once, with endorsements from other major sports unions (150-170 would be required to hit the 30% of employees/contractors threshold needed to register with the National Labor Relations Board).

THAT would be a very interesting day.

Personally, I think the best way to do this would be to organize gyms first, then connect them to each other, and build from there.

 

[1031]

The fighters with the most influence over the UFC, the ones at the type like McGregor or Jones, those are the ones with the most to lose. A major player or five will have to fall on their swords.

I think this one should be the easiest to overcome.
Jon Jones and Conor McGregor need opponents. They cannot exist without competition.
On a separate note, even the best fighters should understand that what goes up must come down i.e. a parachute or something to break the fall is a good thing. Bad luck in the form of injury or accident can strike anyone.

 

[Howard Moon]

"“The one thing that I worried about was the content of the seminar. It was hard to watch because I was like, do these people believe what they’re saying, and they just don’t know? Or are they aware, and it’s a show? I want to say that every single one of us at least, I don’t know how many times that weekend, were looking at each other rolling our eyes. But also all of us in the fear of, we don’t even get to do anything about this."

This is like every orientation or safety meeting in the oilsands. A bunch of clowns who have no understanding of what we do, talking down to us. Welcome to the corporate world, Cat, it doesn't get any better.

 

[Chromium]

I think this one should be the easiest to overcome.
Jon Jones and Conor McGregor need opponents. They cannot exist without competition.
On a separate note, even the best fighters should understand that what goes up must come down i.e. a parachute or something to break the fall is a good thing. Bad luck in the form of injury or accident can strike anyone.

This is true, and it's also why I see entire divisions as valuable, and why I think the midcard should get paid more. And you're right, I think this is probably the easiest to overcome. Another thing about this is that those guys have teammates they care about. The UFC might give individual favors to their teammates today, like Artem Lobov getting a headlining spot, or Jessamyn Duke not getting cut until she'd lost four straight, but I think their team in general would rather their futures be guaranteed.

But it's still an obstacle to overcome. If Conor McGregor decided to be the face of the union, my respect for him would skyrocket.

 

[Rambo John J]

Kobe made 1,150,000 dollars his first year and he was like 18-19

LOL why have him speak to these fighters with only a few bucks in the account

 

[Rambo John J]

That was a fantastic article. I've always liked Cat, and now I like her even more!

gotta agree...cat is very nice on the eyes and the soul

 

[Hong Kong Phooey]

Mee OWW

 

[Dat Pre-HollyHolm Ronda $]

Can't wait till Viacom buys them out....

I got no proof whatsoever but I'd bet the house they want fucking out already

 

[La Paix]

"“The one thing that I worried about was the content of the seminar. It was hard to watch because I was like, do these people believe what they’re saying, and they just don’t know? Or are they aware, and it’s a show? I want to say that every single one of us at least, I don’t know how many times that weekend, were looking at each other rolling our eyes. But also all of us in the fear of, we don’t even get to do anything about this."

This is like every orientation or safety meeting in the oilsands. A bunch of clowns who have no understanding of what we do, talking down to us. Welcome to the corporate world, Cat, it doesn't get any better.

Fucking nailed it.

I'm guessing you've been in the exact same scenarios in the oil industry as I have. Every article I've read on this retreat has reminded me of my time up in Alberta. Its a big circus with cheap handouts trying to convince you to stay and remember how important you are to the cause and then when it's all over it's like it never even happened. And don't even try to do the "hang on, just the other day you were up front saying X, Y and Z but now you're saying something totally different?..." This is a great way to get on the next layoff a list or look like an idiot for a really buying into a what was said. It's just a bunch of money and time spent ultimately to make those up top feel good about fooling us. If you try to hold them to their word you're laughed at, try to call them on those bullshit you're chastised for challenging those who run the show.