Discussion in 'The Off-topic Lounge' started by Toelocku, Oct 8, 2019.
She needs a new case for her phone.
Kind of ironic considering George w Bush ran his campaigns as anti gay marriage.
Its about being in the club
Remember Democrats and Republicans really play for the same team behind the scenes..
Ellen is a key player in social engineering the stay at home house mommies.
People are wimps. I'd have a beer with any of you.
Gw bush isn't the caricature that's been created. Ostracizing people from society doesn't change their mind. I doubt evil GW is pulling one over on Republicans, the Obama's, and Ellen. Maybe he's just a guy that had a hard job...and president isn't king, but one piece of a machine.
The hosts here are doing their own virtue signaling. That's pretty annoying.
W oversaw the worst regime since Warren Gamaliel Harding. I'd go through a thousand years of Trump just to not have to relive those 8 years. Michelle Obama's normalization of him at least was a function of having to associate with him as first lady. Ellen's explanation is dastardly. There are hundreds of thousands of people dead because of Bush's ineptitude and cruelty. Everytime I see him in public, I wish someone was taking off their shoe.
Jr. was more of a puppet - no real power - Slick Dick was the Master Mind with his old cronies Wolfie - Rummy - Condie - Powell who were doing all the shady shit behind the scenes.
Doesn't matter whether he wielded the power or just stood at the front of it. It was in his name and he gets no pass.
Obama launched a few drone strikes that killed many innocent people, he too should not get no pass...yes yes?
The blood shed is shared by both parties - both parties have profited off the loss of human life.
Even if one agrees with your overall stance, how does this minimize her culpability compared to Ellen?
Although Obama and Bush don't always agree on things, Obama said, she still considered the former president a "beautiful, funny, kind, sweet man."
'I love him to death'
This is far more glowing than a forced professionalism in the political arena.
The outrage over them sitting next to each other is pathetic.
Well bless this day. I finally agree with 99.9% of something you said.
Well, except Powell. He was a sacrificial puppet too.
I thought that too at first in the early days but as the years went by and the more interviews I heard of his I suspected he may have been a willing participant.
Condi & Powell were both kinda puppets too bro
More than anyone by far iirc.
Because the first lady has state functions that make it a literal impossibility to be anything but publicly glowing toward other heads of state. This is a well understood political convention and really only found exceptions in a few cases like Barbara Bush and Nancy Reagan who famously disliked one another, but still smiled for the cameras and Hillary Clinton who of course leveled criticism at her husband's successor as a political rival in the Senate. There are likely others from the past, but certainly not in the modern media environment. It would be sort of absurd to expect FLOTUS rhetoric to ever be anything besides needlessly effusive. Michelle has also been fairly oblique in her comments on Trump, famously almost never mentioning him by name, but considering the vitriol this President has heaped on all 3 of his immediate predecessors and their families, it's hard to imagine they'll all have much cordiality after he's out.
Ellen is a civilian. She has no state function and never has. My problem isn't that she's a friend of GWB or anyone, it's that she couched said friendship in terms of disagreement over ideas. There isn't disagreement. There's mass murder over false pretenses and real material changes to the entire fabric of American and global life thanks to this true villain of history. I get sick everytime I see Bush.
What does that have to do with this?
I feel like you're giving her a pass when quite clearly she is capable of muted responses to Trump letting the world know where she stands. Surely, if she finds Bush so abhorrent, she would use professional terms to maintain public respect for the office without going above and beyond. I just think she doesn't find him as repugnant as you do.
Understood. But the reaction to her was the mere being nice to Bush at a game. Twitterati doesn't allow that. At least your issue is with her response after the fact and disliking her reasons.
Did people give Jimmy Kimmel this level of vitriol for having bush on? I honestly don't know
What possible stakes could I have in giving Michelle a pass for anything? Because she's a Democrat? Because she's black? If I were a white Republican, would you make the same judgment? I have no reason to care about either when it comes to the treatment of George Bush. Instead, I'm saying it's reasonable to expect effusiveness as a ceremonial gesture of office. It's less reasonable to characterize these statements as somehow wildly above and beyond normal FLOTUS rhetoric. If she personally doesn't find him repugnant, it wouldn't surprise me as she's married to a guy with his own liters of blood on his hands and I'm sure they've both had to do their own rationalizations of what it means to be President and why things that really aren't forgivable should be.
I think the issue I articulated re: Ellen has come in two forms. One was the usual media spectacle of the two sitting next to one another, which is stupid because they're both rich and at a game and wealthy or influential people find themselves in all sorts of places together. It's similar to the oft trotted out photo of Jill Stein and Putin at a table together at some dinner. That's completely reasonable to expect to happen. Even them laughing at something together is reasonable as basic cordiality allows for moments of unexpected or purposeful humor. What was gross was her calling him a friend, playing some I have friends who disagree with me line to raucous studio audience applause and eliding the fact that this guy is a war criminal. That criticism has also been in circulation, but is much more submerged under, "hey Ellen, that's like totally messed up that you're gay next to your gay wife and like this guy tried to prevent gay marriage," which I'd argue falls under typical clucking tongues call out identity based critiques. Implicit in that critique is "Ellen, you're a fake gay" or "Rich gays forget their history," both of which are popular, but uninteresting arguments. Ellen, again, is a civilian. She has no reason to be pals with Bush or interact with him except willfully. That she chooses to just means she keeps dastardly company, for which she deserves castigation if she also wants to identify herself with the Left.
I didn't know Kimmel had Bush on, but if so, it sounds stupid, especially when he gets on TV and cries about Trump and guns. Like does he know how many Iraqi kids died? F all these showbiz rubes.
Broham. No. Quadruple no. Stop that.
And yes I would.
Purely because I think you have couched her opinion in a frame of full-time FLOTUS when I see her ability to provide a range of responses in that frame, and her words are far beyond what I think the expectation actually is...even for that position. I'm focused on the fact that I think your opinion of FLOTUS effusiveness is explaining away her glowing review of GW.
I think she really likes the guy. I feel like pointing out that she is framed as FLOTUS facade discounts that. And I'm saying that quite clearly it appears she really likes the guy and that's my opinion. But it's not just pomp and circumstance. Twitter should be furious. But Twitter found it cute. The mob loves it. But hated Ellen at a game sitting in the same box as GW.
Your comments about "fake gay" are the exact kind of implication that rub me wrong here with attacking her premier league sitting next to somebody and being cordial for all the same reasons you mentioned Stein and Putin etc. Again this is the foundation of the mob.
But you don't care too much about that anyways because I have been paying attention to the Twitter response here which is what started everything. It only on the second part of your post did you explain your issue is not being friends with him. And there is the divide between DeGeneres and Obama that I stated I understood. There are two acts and the first is the unruly mob of cancel culture unhappy at the cultural aspect of Ellen's nicety....couching this as LGBTQ issues. in that frame I also understand Ellen's response focused on disagreement. Your issues with GW seem far more substantive than the mob. And with it, as I said, I understand your issue with her response. But as you said, these opinions are not the loudest in the Twitter mob that started all of this.
I have zero idea what autocorrect did there. But I see you're viewing the thread so I'm not going to edit it right now. Lol