TJ Dillashaw lashes out on fighter treatment

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kneeblock

Drapetomaniac
Apr 18, 2015
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T.J. Dillashaw took the UFC to task this week for what he perceives as an issue with fighter treatment.

The former UFC bantamweight champion said on Team Alpha Male's Stud Show Radio that he believes the UFC treats fighters like employees rather than what they legally are: independent contractors. Dillashaw pointed to the UFC's deals with Reebok and USADA as potential evidence.

"They treat us like employees, but they don't give us benefits like employees," Dillashaw said. "It's kind of crazy when you think about it. We have to tell them where we're at at all times, so USADA can show up and drug test us. But we don't get health benefits. It's kind of crazy that we are controlled. Any time you have to tell work where you're at and what you're doing, that's considered an employee, not a contractor. They can't tell a subcontractor what to do and when to do it. So this whole drug-testing thing is kind of crazy and the way they're making us wear Reebok and all this stuff we have to do. They're treating us like employees, but not giving us the benefits of an employee.

T.J. Dillashaw slams the UFC for treating fighters like employees minus the benefits
 
M

member 3289

Guest
Don't forget they make them wear uniforms.

24 hour location reporting, mandatory uniforms, restrictive contracts...

Independent contractors lol
 

Qat

QoQ
Nov 3, 2015
16,385
22,624
The topic isn't really accurate, its not so much about pay but about conditions.

I was surprised though, his pay seems abysmal, he has enough reasons to complain.
 

Robbie Hart

All Biden Voters Are Mindless Sheep
Feb 13, 2015
49,761
50,749


T.J. Dillashaw took the UFC to task this week for what he perceives as an issue with fighter treatment.

The former UFC bantamweight champion said on Team Alpha Male's Stud Show Radio that he believes the UFC treats fighters like employees rather than what they legally are: independent contractors. Dillashaw pointed to the UFC's deals with Reebok and USADA as potential evidence.

"They treat us like employees, but they don't give us benefits like employees," Dillashaw said. "It's kind of crazy when you think about it. We have to tell them where we're at at all times, so USADA can show up and drug test us. But we don't get health benefits. It's kind of crazy that we are controlled. Any time you have to tell work where you're at and what you're doing, that's considered an employee, not a contractor. They can't tell a subcontractor what to do and when to do it. So this whole drug-testing thing is kind of crazy and the way they're making us wear Reebok and all this stuff we have to do. They're treating us like employees, but not giving us the benefits of an employee.

T.J. Dillashaw slams the UFC for treating fighters like employees minus the benefits
He's got a point
 

kneeblock

Drapetomaniac
Apr 18, 2015
12,435
23,026
The topic isn't really accurate, its not so much about pay but about conditions.

I was surprised though, his pay seems abysmal, he has enough reasons to complain.
Thanks. Corrected. I saw him mention pay but you're right. It's more about conditions.
 

bluzmeister

Member
Jul 19, 2016
4
8
TJ and all fighters concerned about this issue have a course of action they can take and it doesn't cost a dime. Maybe a postage stamp is all. They all need to fill out IRS Form SS-8 (and submit to the IRS), which the IRS then uses to determine if a worker's existing or prior work situation is / was that of an employee or that of an independent contractor. The vast majority of people who request a determination are workers (versus employers / business ownners), and the percentage of determinations that come back as employee are in the 80-85% range so chances are high that a determination would be made that UFC fighters have been miscategorized and the UFC stands to be penalized BIG TIME if they make that determination (based on penalties and unpaid FUTA, FICA, Medicare, SS, and other employee related taxes and employer portion of contributions to Medicare and SS). DO IT fighters or you're all deserving of what TJ is whining about. There's your avenue. No court case or lawsuit required.
 
Last edited:

bluzmeister

Member
Jul 19, 2016
4
8
TJ and all fighters concerned about this issue have a course of action they can take and it doesn't cost a dime. Maybe a postage stamp is all. They all need to fill out IRS Form SS-8 (and submit it to the IRS), which the IRS then uses to determine if a worker's existing or prior work situation is / was that of an employee or that of an independent contractor. The vast majority of people who request a determination are workers (versus employers / business ownners), and the percentage of determinations that come back as employee are in the 80-85% range so chances are high that a determination would be made that UFC fighters have been miscategorized and the UFC standas to be penalized BIG TIME if they make that determination (based on penalties for unpaid FUTA, FICA, Medicare, SS, and other employee related taxes and employer portion of contributions to Medicare and SS). DO IT fighters or you're all deserving of what TJ is complaining about. There's your avenue. No court case or lawsuit required. If you don't then don't whine about it 'cause UFC doesn't give a cr*p.
 

bluzmeister

Member
Jul 19, 2016
4
8
Don't forget they make them wear uniforms.

24 hour location reporting, mandatory uniforms, restrictive contracts...

Independent contractors lol
Filling out an IRS SS-8 form will allow the IRS to officially and legally make the determination of contractor or employee and could affect all UFC fighters. Someone needs to educate them all (the fighters), on IRS law on employee versus contractor. That or they should just submit that form. Won't cost them any more than a postage stamp. Form is simple enough and the determination takes anywhere from a couple weeks to six months.
 

Woko

Top dog isn't my desire, it's just my design.
Apr 19, 2016
669
790
TJ and all fighters concerned about this issue have a course of action they can take and it doesn't cost a dime. Maybe a postage stamp is all. They all need to fill out IRS Form SS-8 (and submit to the IRS), which the IRS then uses to determine if a worker's existing or prior work situation is / was that of an employee or that of an independent contractor. The vast majority of people who request a determination are workers (versus employers / business ownners), and the percentage of determinations that come back as employee are in the 80-85% range so chances are high that a determination would be made that UFC fighters have been miscategorized and the UFC stands to be penalized BIG TIME if they make that determination (based on penalties and unpaid FUTA, FICA, Medicare, SS, and other employee related taxes and employer portion of contributions to Medicare and SS). DO IT fighters or you're all deserving of what TJ is whining about. There's your avenue. No court case or lawsuit required.
I'm pretty sure that there are loopholes to be exploited and that the contracts presented by UFC are scrutinised in fine detail by an in-house team of experts in this field. It's a little naive to think that this has simply been overlooked.
 

bluzmeister

Member
Jul 19, 2016
4
8
"I'm pretty sure that there are loopholes to be exploited and that the contracts presented by UFC are scrutinised in fine detail by an in-house team of experts in this field. It's a little naive to think that this has simply been overlooked"

You'd be surprised... I'm not an attorney, but I have prevailed (in every instance), over many an attorney in countless legal controversies ranging from IRS tax issues to Fema damage claims, automobile insurance tort claims, holding state goverment to account, lemon law buybacks (against three attorneys in two new vehicle cases and I still won both), and lots more. Being an attorney does not mean you know everything about every law. Not even tax attorneys or tax prepairers, CPAs are fully knowledgeable on all tax law I have found. If I have a tax question, I will contact the IRS Office of Chief Council in Washington DC, not H&R block or a tax attorney or CPA, as the IRS is the entity with the power to impose taxes...The UFC may have a team of attorneys, but that doesn't mean they fully know the law as pertains to this employee vs contractor issue. In that regard it is you who are being naive that they have scriutinized this issue in fine detail sufficient to make a determination. The simple way to find out is to have fighters submit the SS-8 form and neither you nor I nor the UFC or fighters are authorized to make that determination. That is solely within the purview of the IRS (or the courts).
 

Woko

Top dog isn't my desire, it's just my design.
Apr 19, 2016
669
790
"I'm pretty sure that there are loopholes to be exploited and that the contracts presented by UFC are scrutinised in fine detail by an in-house team of experts in this field. It's a little naive to think that this has simply been overlooked"

You'd be surprised... I'm not an attorney, but I have prevailed (in every instance), over many an attorney in countless legal controversies ranging from IRS tax issues to Fema damage claims, automobile insurance tort claims, holding state goverment to account, lemon law buybacks (against three attorneys in two new vehicle cases and I still won both), and lots more. Being an attorney does not mean you know everything about every law. Not even tax attorneys or tax prepairers, CPAs are fully knowledgeable on all tax law I have found. If I have a tax question, I will contact the IRS Office of Chief Council in Washington DC, not H&R block or a tax attorney or CPA, as the IRS is the entity with the power to impose taxes...The UFC may have a team of attorneys, but that doesn't mean they fully know the law as pertains to this employee vs contractor issue. In that regard it is you who are being naive that they have scriutinized this issue in fine detail sufficient to make a determination. The simple way to find out is to have fighters submit the SS-8 form and neither you nor I nor the UFC or fighters are authorized to make that determination. That is solely within the purview of the IRS (or the courts).
So are you effectively stating that, within US law, there is no such thing as a safely exploitable loophole?

Also, I said you were naive due to the detailing of your point. The rigidity of your point simply does not allow for the potential of loopholes or the obvious team at UFC who focus on these issues.

I am an astute individual who can easily dissect legal statement or description and fully understand the overriding premise. In context, the premise here is that you are quite a conceited person who, due to a handful of victories, fully believes that he/she can 'educate' the little brains on here.

So, what is your record (W? L? NC?) against attorneys.
Obviously you will have lost more against the knowledgeable attorneys who are conscientious enough to know the tax laws relating to their cases. All you've done is conducted a process of researching in detail where a law has been broken etc.
Does that mean you know everything about the tax laws? No.
What's to say that your almighty intellect hasn't identified a loophole that's been spotted and dotted by someone else?
Tax laws are never black and white, there is ambiguity from top to bottom, this allows for creative uses of the laws that bind.

I suggest you focus your time on Amazon, who employ people with the solitary tasks of identifying every single tax-related loophole for every single country in which they trade and to assist with the implementation of structures and processes that fully exploit the flexibility of every tax bubble without bursting it. I know that the UFC have a team with a similar objective and Amazon prove how to best apply a prodigious IQ.
 

benjo0101

TMMAC Addict
Jun 13, 2016
6,452
7,106
"I'm pretty sure that there are loopholes to be exploited and that the contracts presented by UFC are scrutinised in fine detail by an in-house team of experts in this field. It's a little naive to think that this has simply been overlooked"

You'd be surprised... I'm not an attorney, but I have prevailed (in every instance), over many an attorney in countless legal controversies ranging from IRS tax issues to Fema damage claims, automobile insurance tort claims, holding state goverment to account, lemon law buybacks (against three attorneys in two new vehicle cases and I still won both), and lots more. Being an attorney does not mean you know everything about every law. Not even tax attorneys or tax prepairers, CPAs are fully knowledgeable on all tax law I have found. If I have a tax question, I will contact the IRS Office of Chief Council in Washington DC, not H&R block or a tax attorney or CPA, as the IRS is the entity with the power to impose taxes...The UFC may have a team of attorneys, but that doesn't mean they fully know the law as pertains to this employee vs contractor issue. In that regard it is you who are being naive that they have scriutinized this issue in fine detail sufficient to make a determination. The simple way to find out is to have fighters submit the SS-8 form and neither you nor I nor the UFC or fighters are authorized to make that determination. That is solely within the purview of the IRS (or the courts).
Why have you got yourself into so many positions where you need to take on tax laws? Seems weird.

Also, you are assuming that the UFC employs average lawyers. I am reasonably sure they employ very very very good lawyers. Not to be harsh, but if you can think of it the UFC lawyers probably did too.