Discussion in 'Cageside - MMA Discussion' started by MovinOn, Jan 10, 2019.
So he is innocent
I mentioned that it was a different substance up there ^.
The truth is, nobody knows the science on this. That fact doesn't help USADA's credibility, but I would rather them not convict a guilty person out of an abundance of caution than have a zero tolerance policy. If they don't know for sure, they shouldn't be able to punish the athlete imo. Too much grey area shit out there to pretend we know what people are doing.
My only point is that whether or not USADA and Novitzky are lying, this doesn't seem to be evidence in either direction.
Ohh my bad. I agree too. They shouldnt be punishing guys when they have no clue what they are doing
What gets my jimmys rustled is they appeared to throw the book at everyone
except Jones. I honestly don't care if Juicy juices... Just stop throwing the book at
other people and letting Juicy fail tests left and right
I think the reason they are stating things that are incorrect and stumbling all over
themselves is that they fucked up and cant admit they don't know what the fuck they
are looking at and have ruined fighters careers.
Thats a huge liability and they are covering their asses now
Finally, a win for a rich sports athlete. It about time they get the benefit of the doubt...
Just as clean as a brand new pack of syringes
I keep hearing this "they are throwing the book at everyone" thing, but there have been several fighters who got exonerated through evidence. Cyborg got a retroactive TUE. Tim Means, Yoel Romero... there has always been room for fighters to try to fight the charges.
I think they are stumbling because they don't understand the science completely and they can't prosecute. This isn't a belief I am married to, though, because I don't think anybody has enough information.
I can't speak on Cyborg and Tim but I thought they found the supplement
that Yoel got popped for?
Also did those guys piss hot on USADA tests multiple times like Jon?
He seems to have gotten far less punishment then everyone else for as much
as he has pissed hot
means and romero actually went to a hearing
Jon is allowed to test positive and fight 3 weeks later with no hearing
double standard is what is pissing people off
I am cool with PEDs legal or PEDs banned, just don't spin the rules to protect one fighter over another...that is total BS
this is madness. 'i could be pulsing for years!!! ... oh no, all gone'
could there be any louder sirens? how is this not imprisonable?
Now my posts are being screwed up by this pulsing
"Post Pulsing" is a serious problem. Several other experts that work for me
are in agreement.
This pulsing could fuck up my posts for years
Means and Romero had confirmed positive tests. Comparing Jones' situation to anyone aside from MAYBE Mir's would result in a false equivalency. It's not a black or white process because it shouldn't be.
They did find the supplement for Yoel. I am just saying that they haven't dropped the hammer on everyone, they let their process take its course.
Jones hasn't been declared an intentional cheat yet, so his rap would be perpetual negligence, which is bad but it's not viewed by USADA as if it were multiple intentional ingestions.
Not saying that's legit, just saying that would explain why things are approached differently. Every situation is different.
I don't think you realize what actually happened/happening
Jon Failed a test on december 9th....It is actually the 9th failed test in 4 years for Jon
At least two fighters have been suspended/punished for having less of the metabolite in them than Jon did.
THIS ENTIRE LIE IS ABOUT NOT GIVING JON A 3RD STRIKE AND POTENTIAL LIFETIME BAN
The entire Lie is about making excuses for a guy that keeps failing PED tests...If you don't want to come to grips with this then that is on you brother.
The guy cheated and is cheating still...plain and simp.
If you want to believe he only pulses before fights then by all means enjoy...please don't expect me to buy into that shit.
It is a black and white process...and they changed the rules of the process to make this event happen and to even allow Jon to sign a contract to fight(they knew he kept Pulsing/AKA testing for PEDs and had to figure out how to explain it)
I propose we both Optimistic rating each other and call it a night
I can appreciate that point of view
Its actually just a slight tweak in our definitions where we differ
You view it as "Perpetual Negligence"
Where I view it as "Habitual Line Stepper" as Charlie Murphy would say. Lol
And there it is. I forgot to add my "I am not saying Jones is telling the truth" caveat so you bring in your habitual straw man.
The two fighters you are referring to are Tom Lawlor and Frank Mir.
Tom Lawlor had 16 picograms of ostarine in his system. He had not been punished for these picograms, he had the actual parent molecule in his system, and he couldn't prove a tainted supplement, so he was punished fully.
Frank Mir had (can't remember how many) picograms of the same metabolite that Jones popped for. These are simply long term metabolites, but Mir hadn't been punished for them initially being ingested into his system, so they punished him.
The gripes I can see in those are regarding Mir apparently being told that the metabolites couldn't be around for as long as they apparently were with Jones according to USADA, and Jones getting his suspension shortened for "substantial assistance," the details of which were never and probably will never be made public.
Yes, I know what has happened. Yes, it's still ridiculous to pretend that you 100% know for sure what's going on.
I don't hand out optimistic ratings because I am not passive aggressive. If I think you're being optimistic, I will either tell you why or I will leave it alone.
Yeah, and given his history I can't blame you for seeing it that way. I think the most important part of my opinion in all of this is that whatever we say is comprised of speculation and it's irresponsible to be 100% sure and bullish either way.
so still rolling with the unintentional use angle?
This better be an attempt at a joke. Haha
Fuck Jon Jones and fuck the USADA. Iff you believe he's innocent you are a retard.
I do get that you are being the devils advocate to my opinion...but to think this is anything but a coverup seems ludicrous to me.
How about a hit and run that he got away from. That would give anyone at least a year in the slammer.
FYI when I say take care I actually mean it...not in a passive aggressive way
I wish all I converse with good health and happiness...unless they mean me ill will, and this is just discussing an athletes drug usage and punishment
i couldnt have said it better myself