Weight Cuts in MMA

[Deleted member 1]

I'm going to be doing a bunch of reading over the next week, but started here.

Documenting The Tolls of Rapid Extreme Weight Cuts in MMA | Combat Sports Law

@ErikMagraken has compiled a list of attributed complications to weight cutting.

For those that don't know, when I'm not hanging out on here, I do some medical stuff Admittedly, I feel I know very little about some of the potential effects expected and unexpected that come with repeat weight cuts over time. Here is a list of acute weight cut problems from Erik:

• Canadian fighter Jer Kornelsen requiring CPR following losing consciousness during a cut
• fighter Jordan Murray requiring gallbladder surgery due to weight cutting
• Rodrigo Damm being forced out of UFC Fight Night 29 due to Kidney Issues caused by a drastic weight cut
• Nova Uniao flyweight fighter Leandro “Feijao” Souza passed away while cutting weight
• UFC Fighter Brian Melancon retired due to reduced kidney function attributed to the demands of REWL practices
• Daniel Cormier’s kidney failure, brought on by excessive weight cutting
• T.J. Cook suffered kidney failure in the ring
• Yoon Young Kim reportedly suffered a mild heart attack while cutting
• Ulysses Gomez was hospitalized after collapsing while attempting to make weight
• Marcus Davis revealed that a “tortured” weight cut nearly killed him.
• Three college wrestler deaths in a 6 week period due to weight cutting
• (update September 8, 2014) – Charles Oliveira reporting “high fever, headaches and vomiting” during failed cut
• (update October 5, 2014) In order to make weight for the Battlegrounds tournament, Cody McKenzie resorted to drawing blood in order to shed his final 1.4 pounds.
• (update November 15, 2014) Although not MMA, amateur Kickboxer Dennis Munson Jr. died after his first kickboxing bout which included a same day weigh in where the fighter reportedly had difficulties with the cut down to 135.
• (update January 30, 2015) Kevin Gastelum reportedly was hospitalized while cutting weight before UFC 183.
• (update February 9, 2015) That time when UFC asked Paul Redmond to cut 36 pounds in 13 days. While he was not reportedly injured this story takes away any shred of deniability that the UFC has knowledge of the dangerous cuts their fighters attempt to make.
• (update February 13, 2015) Nick Lentz was pulled from UFC Fight Night 60 after experiencing “flu like symptoms” on weigh in day
• (update February 21, 2015) T.J. Waldburger faints during weight cut for UFC Fight Night 61 and is forced to withdraw from the bout. While commenting on this development MMA official record keeper Kirik Jenness provided the following sobering story: “I have reffed, judged, cornered, and occasionally fought in hundreds of MMA contests; the worst injury I ever saw was not from a strike, slam, or submission. I was the ref.I taped his hands, because he was cornered by his brother, and neither knew how to wrap. I spoke with him some, to settle his nerves, and learned he was a first-time fighter, and a little older, with a background in traditional martial arts.In the second round something wasn’t right, so I stopped it. There wasn’t much protest. Then he passed out in the locker room. Then his heart stopped in the ambulance. He was airlifted to Boston, where he was diagnosed with renalfailure.Day after day, I sought word on his condition; eventually his kidneys started on their own, so he didn’t need to be on dialysis for the rest of his life.The cause was a combination of the Atkins diet, then water weight cutting, and then heavy exertion under TV lights.“
• (update April 9, 2015) Ronny Markes is forced to withdraw from WSOF 20 due to ‘dehydration’
• (update April 27, 2015) MixedMartialArts.com reports that a fighter in Washington State collapsed post bout with kidney failure and died shortly after and question whether rapid weight cut practices may have played a role. From early media reports it is unclear whether weight cut practices played any role.
• (update May 5, 2015) Invicta’s Veronica Rothenhausler announcement retirement after prolonged post concussive issues which she in part relates to rapid extreme weight cut practices.

A lot of this is acute. Acute weight cutting is essentially planned dehydration. You shift fluid balance, electrolyte balance, reduce perfusion to your kidneys, and change return or lack there of to the heart. Severe cases could easily result in serious kidney injury or heart arrhythmias. There is a small chance you could shift fluids in certain ways to cause serious or fatal neurological complications.

If you have read something about chronic weight cutting side effects, post it here. Lets talk about it. I'll be hunting through journals for consensus. If you have a study references somewhere, let me know and I'll try to track down the original source and we can analyze it.

If you wonder about acute weight cutting or know how it coud be safer, lets talk about that too!

 

[ThatOneDude]

I've cut weight a few times in my younger days and it fucking sucked! I'd much rather see fighters fighting at there natural weight. I think we would see better fights and less injuries.

 

[Wild]

Extreme weight cutting, without properly rehydrating, really makes me concerned for fighters safety (specifically brain trauma). I don't know what the answer is, but I don't like the current system. Too much risk involved. I wish guys would fight more towards their natural weight, but I'm not naive to think that is going to happen.

 

[ECC170]

It amazes me how hs and college wrestlers cut ad wrestle the same day..I wrestled 5x every single Saturday during both seasons of wrestling freestyle and Folk..

Luckily I was strong ad never cut much weight...UNTIL my MMA days..that's when my horror stories took place..Its amazing how resilient a young body is going through your body and Brains development..but that's the dangerous part...One becomes to believe they are invincible and push the limits...

There's a big diff in throwing on the sweats and and drilling few waterpounds off..Its another to lose a Toddler worth the fluids in X amount of hours..Its the closest thing to death I can describe..and the Reepers knocked Twice..

 

[Deleted member 1]

Extreme weight cutting, without properly rehydrating,

The issue here is that you may not get a chance to properly rehydrate.
There is a potential for your kidneys to get too far gone. Could even end up on dialysis temporarily or permanently. That's rare but can definitely happen. But the damage done in a stair step type fashion, in which you decline function a little more each time, is very real.

 

[Priziesthorse]

I like to cut a couple pounds of water weight before I hit the beach to really accentuate my abs.

 

[ErikMagraken]

I'm going to be doing a bunch of reading over the next week, but started here.

Documenting The Tolls of Rapid Extreme Weight Cuts in MMA | Combat Sports Law

@ErikMagraken has compiled a list of attributed complications to weight cutting.

For those that don't know, when I'm not hanging out on here, I do some medical stuff Admittedly, I feel I know very little about some of the potential effects expected and unexpected that come with repeat weight cuts over time. Here is a list of acute weight cut problems from Erik:




A lot of this is acute. Acute weight cutting is essentially planned dehydration. You shift fluid balance, electrolyte balance, reduce perfusion to your kidneys, and change return or lack there of to the heart. Severe cases could easily result in serious kidney injury or heart arrhythmias. There is a small chance you could shift fluids in certain ways to cause serious or fatal neurological complications.

If you have read something about chronic weight cutting side effects, post it here. Lets talk about it. I'll be hunting through journals for consensus. If you have a study references somewhere, let me know and I'll try to track down the original source and we can analyze it.

If you wonder about acute weight cutting or know how it coud be safer, lets talk about that too!

Thanks for sharing this here. I've given a lot of thought to this topic over the last few years and the best solution I could think of is to require fighters to pass a hydration test at the same time that they make weight. If the only way fighter's can make weight is by being dehydrated then they don't fight.

 

[girlandcoconut]

I have what I believe to be limited experience but compared to the average person, probably pretty decent amount as I did prep for and compete in a few bodybuilding shows and was/still close to MANY competitors at all levels, including many pros, also friends with several MMA fighters and also have a lot of contacts in the "fitness" "nutrition" biz. Health in general is a huge passion of mine so in addition to my own personal experience, what I've seen/heard/watched, I've also read up on all of this and followed trends for a few years now.

I have ALWAYS been extremely surprised that in professional sports, the topic of weight cutting for aesthetic or target weight purposes has been handled so haphazardly, in my opinion, criminally in the majority of cases. There are ways to "cut" in a deliberate, non-health affecting manner. I have a friend who is a pro-competitor and she has a kidney condition that she's had her whole life that does not allow her to cut hard or dehydrate so she had to learn to do it a smart way.

I also competed at a show with a girl who within a few hours of the finals, was texting me that she had gained 10 pounds. I told her, not normal AT ALL, go to ER. She didn't, texted me at midnight, up 20 pounds, urged her to go to ER, she did, kidneys were borderline non-functional and could have turned life threatening. And she didn't even do anything even remotely extreme. There was a show here last weekend and I'm friends with competitors and coaches and heard about 2 people who passed out shortly after walking off stage. One of the years I competed, a guy dropped dead on stage.

Ultimately, ego drives these sports that have a need for this type of practice. Most participating don't actually care what the best way to do it is, being more concerned with the results and getting there as fast as they can, happened to me too, I speak from experience here. It goes back to a comment I just made on another post, the whole scarcity mindset. Typically a "cut" is needed because the day to day lifestyle and health of the person isn't such that their body naturally stays lean and doesn't require such drastic measures. There are also the small percentage that are trying to force their bodies into a state that is completely unnatural and there will never be a "healthy" way to do that. Arbitrarily choosing a weight to cut to because of strategy vs what your individual body is naturally capable of is, in my opinion, completely asinine and reckless.

The other thing that always boggled my mind is why anyone, esp a fighter going into a cage about to have another guy try to rip his noggin off, would want to do something so drastic which absolutely has impacts to performance, etc. I figured well, maybe they just figure the other guy is going through the same thing so even after putting their body through that nonsense, they're still on par with the other guy as far as possible performance degradation.

The fact that most people are taking advice on cutting weight and messing with sodium/hydration from "trainers" or random people who have done it once before and think they all of a sudden know makes me crazy. Like beyond crazy. Y'all, don't get me started. Wait. Oh. /rant

 

[Robbie Hart]

I've cut weight a few times in my younger days and it fucking sucked! I'd much rather see fighters fighting at there natural weight. I think we would see better fights and less injuries.

Wrestled in Jersey many moons ago and would just stop eating and drinking about a day and half before matches and then eat a big fuc-ing hoagie from my friend's italian deli before my match...Mastandrea's deli (remember as he used to pack that motherfuc-er with about 10 pounds of meat for this starving wrestler)........how the fu-k I actually wrestled is an unkown but everyone was cutting so I had to cut. I remember when we got certified each year, there would be a doctor there when i weighed in and i was so rail thin it was ridiculous and dangerous. Even the doctor used to look at me like ffs son, you can't go any lower, that's the lowest you can go weight-wise and can vividly remember one of them was just thinking and rolling his eyes thinking this is bullsh-t. He just looked and though, c'mon this is getting out of hand.

anyway, to my point, agree here with this point and i wonder how much better i could have been without a depleted body and 10 pounds of meat in my stomach.....this shi-t just isn't right.
.

 

[Ryann Von Doom]

Ultimate Weight Cutting Championships

 

[Leigh]

I've lost a few fights due to messing up my weight cut. I now have it dialled in. I start at around 155, weigh in at 135 and go back up to 150-155.

I don't use a sauna and I don't starve - I have 3 meals a day. There are better ways than killing yourself with diuretics and needing an IV to rehydrate but people get paranoid that they'll be too small.

I have learned the hard way that I'd much rather be 5lbs lighter and feel great for the fight.