VID Winkeljohn confirmed to me Jones is preparing for April return! Can UFC 197 in NYC really happen?

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MMA_JIM

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Nov 26, 2015
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I spoke to Mike Wink last night (super nice guy btw!) and he confirmed to me that they are preparing Jones for a return in April. Obviously the UFC have MSG booked on the 23rd - should we even start dreaming about this actually happening?

I made a video about this morning looking at the other things blocking this from taking place. Obviously Cormier doesn't want to fight him there but the more significant thing is the ban on pro-MMA in New York right now :/

Do you guys think this could actually happen?
 

Leigh

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As you say, money talks. The whole NY MMA ban stinks of corruption. Maybe Zuffa need to line the right pockets. Find an approachable judge, offer to take him and his wife out for dinner to discuss the issue, complementary tickets to a game (or an opera or whatever). An outright bribe would probably blow up in their face, as I imagine there is a lot of scrutiny over corruption on this topic after the high profile arrest earlier this year.
 

MMA_JIM

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Nov 26, 2015
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What I talked about here was really the 'lite' version of the entire NYC political situation. I wrote an article just yesterday actually after speaking with some of the local MMA journalists in NYC about the likelihood of it going ahead - they weren't positive at all :(
 

Chief

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I remember that press conference and I found that an odd thing to say by DC. Why should our champion care where he/she fights? This is just rediculous to me and gives ammunition to DC's detractors and paper champ espousers.
 

Chief

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Why thank you. I'm going to try get involved as much as I can. I'm also going to post up these Daily videos when there is potential they create so good chit chat.

Oh btw Chief I love that shirt you got there :D
I look forward to more of your videos.

The shirt! Lol. Our very own lookoutawhale @lookoutawhale made it. He's an awesome guy!
 

Leigh

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I remember that press conference and I found that an odd thing to say by DC. Why should our champion care where he/she fights? This is just rediculous to me and gives ammunition to DC's detractors and paper champ espousers.
The hometown advantage can have a big impact. Matt Serra said that fighting "Captain Canada" in Montreal was crazy and the cage was actually shaking with the sound of all the abuse he was getting.
 

Chief

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The hometown advantage can have a big impact. Matt Serra said that fighting "Captain Canada" in Montreal was crazy and the cage was actually shaking with the sound of all the abuse he was getting.
No doubt a home crowd is a tangible thing. I just feel it's a bad look for a Champion. It's not like when guys say they don't want to fight Vitor in Brazil. That's due to PED regulation. DC is literally saying he doesn't want Jon to have more cheers than him. I don't know man. I just say fight anywhere and prove you're the better man.
 

Robbie Hart

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Daniel can talk and swagger around everywhere but he doesn't want to fight in NY because he doesn't really want to fight Jones.......the reality is, Jones will school him even worse this time around.
 

Leigh

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No doubt a home crowd is a tangible thing. I just feel it's a bad look for a Champion. It's not like when guys say they don't want to fight Vitor in Brazil. That's due to PED regulation. DC is literally saying he doesn't want Jon to have more cheers than him. I don't know man. I just say fight anywhere and prove you're the better man.
I don't mean this to sound condescending although I acknowledge it will come across that way but have you ever had a MMA match? If you haven't, it is easy to miss the impact of some factors that are often overlooked. The recent Ben Askren fiasco is a good example. His opponent missed weight and suddenly people were piling on Ben to come up with a solution. That's not a pressure he should have to face and it could very well affect his mindset going into the fight.

Would you, the actual guy who posts as Chief, fight a guy who has beaten you before in his home town if you had the choice to fight him somewhere else?
 

Chief

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I don't mean this to sound condescending although I acknowledge it will come across that way but have you ever had a MMA match? If you haven't, it is easy to miss the impact of some factors that are often overlooked. The recent Ben Askren fiasco is a good example. His opponent missed weight and suddenly people were piling on Ben to come up with a solution. That's not a pressure he should have to face and it could very well affect his mindset going into the fight.

Would you, the actual guy who posts as Chief, fight a guy who has beaten you before in his home town if you had the choice to fight him somewhere else?
Not condescending at all. I'm not a fighter, I'm a fan.

The Askren situation is different. The opponents are expected to make weight. I think no less of Ben not wanting to fight a guy who missed weight.

But as a fan, I expect my champion to fight whenever, wherever, as long as everything else is above board. But I'm entitled to that opinion, as are you yours.
 

Leigh

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Not condescending at all. I'm not a fighter, I'm a fan.

The Askren situation is different. The opponents are expected to make weight. I think no less of Ben not wanting to fight a guy who missed weight.

But as a fan, I expect my champion to fight whenever, wherever, as long as everything else is above board. But I'm entitled to that opinion, as are you yours.
Yeah of course you are and I'd encourage to you to post it :) I'm just trying to help you maybe view it from a fighter's point of view. Just because someone has the label "fighter" doesn't mean they are immune to the same emotions as everyone else. They are a normal person who just decided to take a MMA fight.
 

Ted Williams' head

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But as a fan, I expect my champion to fight whenever, wherever, as long as everything else is above board. But I'm entitled to that opinion, as are you yours.
Agreed 100%. Guys should fight wherever the fuck the boss says, whatever is best for the company. And that's a huge fight in New York.

You don't need to have had a pro fight to know that a guy would probably rather not fight another guy in his home town, it's not some esoteric insight you gain from actually fighting. Jesus.
 

Chief

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Yeah of course you are and I'd encourage to you to post it :) I'm just trying to help you maybe view it from a fighter's point of view. Just because someone has the label "fighter" doesn't mean they are immune to the same emotions as everyone else. They are a normal person who just decided to take a MMA fight.
I get it. And I'm not shitting on the guy. I just don't like hearing a person who is stepping in front of the world to prove that he is the best 205lb fighter on the planet, qualify that with preconditions. I want him to be the best period. Not the best under special conditions.

But I do understand that these things play a factor, but I'm looking at it as an end consumer.
 

kneeblock

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NY UFC is not happening in 2016 kids. Looking at the political climate here I say 2017 earliest.
 

Wild

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As you say, money talks. The whole NY MMA ban stinks of corruption. Maybe Zuffa need to line the right pockets. Find an approachable judge, offer to take him and his wife out for dinner to discuss the issue, complementary tickets to a game (or an opera or whatever). An outright bribe would probably blow up in their face, as I imagine there is a lot of scrutiny over corruption on this topic after the high profile arrest earlier this year.
My guess is they have been playing this game for a while, but other groups are lining pockets a bit more & have long standing relationships with the decisions makers of the past. I do however think it eventually gets legalized. Hopefully it's this year.
 

Zeph

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Jan 22, 2015
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Both sides have their hands out, some to Zuffa, some to the Unions, both sides keep paying and the bill keeps struggling to get through. I wonder why.
 

MMA_JIM

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Here an extract from an interview I did yesterday with two NYC MMA journalists:

What do the experts say?
Two New York native journalists who are both close to the situation, Jim Genia (@Jim_Genia) and Mark La Monica (LaMonicaMark) told Jim Edwards of MMA Latest their latest thoughts on the situation:

JE: What did you make of the UFC announcing they had booked MSG for UFC 197 in April?

MLM: “It sounds big, but in reality, it’s not much different than in the past when they said they had reserved a date. This was just a press release rather than a quote from Dana White during a news conference. The one difference here, I suppose, is that it was sent out in conjunction with their re-filing of a federal lawsuit against the state.”

JG: It’s a brilliant move because it gives them the legal standing they need to get somewhere with their lawsuit against New York.


JE: If you had to say out of 10 how likely the event was to go ahead in April (10 being very likely) how would you rate it?

MLM: It’s too hard to truly put a number on it other than 50/50 (5/10). Either it happens or it doesn’t.

JG: A solid 2/10. The April show is premised on the NY Combative Sports Law remaining the way it is, with its ban on pro-MMA except for that which is sanctioned by an approved third-party organization. But the UFC is fighting this war on multiple fronts, and they’re on the cusp of getting things done via the legislature. If the Combative Sports Law is changed there first, then there is no longer any loophole that would allow the UFC to use a third-party to sanction their April show.


JE: From your understanding have any circumstances changed since the bill to legalise MMA wasn’t passed earlier year?

MLM: Nothing significant, as far as I am aware.

JG: There has been a push to get the MMA bill passed early in the 2016 session instead of waiting until the end as usual. Since there will be an Assembly committee hearing on the topic on December 11 – before the session has even begun – I’d say that push is working.


JE: What do you believe has to fundamentally change for MMA to be finally legalised in the state of New York?

MLM: Public comments in favor of the bill from powerful legislators in New York would be a boost, I suppose.

JG: Nothing. We’re where we want to be.



They don't sound overly hopeful tbh :( full interview here: http://www.mmalatestnews.com/jimtalk-will-jones-vs-cormier-at-ufc-197-in-new-york-happen/
 

Priziesthorse

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The hometown advantage can have a big impact. Matt Serra said that fighting "Captain Canada" in Montreal was crazy and the cage was actually shaking with the sound of all the abuse he was getting.
I think the NY area is a different animal. I was at UFC 159 Jones vs Sonnen in Newark,NJ which is 10 miles from NYC and a short train ride away. He was heavily booed during his entrance. I'm not sure the ppl of NYC would give Jones a hometown welcome.
 

kneeblock

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Interesting. Care to expand?
Carl Heastie, our Assembly Speaker, took a beating over a few rookie moves he made last year. He's now spending time trying to recast himself as ready for the job and anti-corruption in the wake of former leaders Silver and Skelos currently being on trial for all kinds of graft. Next year several assembly members are facing reelection so are likely in a don't rock the boat mode. Also, since both Heastie and Governor Cuomo have come out in support of MMA, there are plenty who will vote against it just to spite them for other favors not granted, particularly at the end of the legislative session when it usually comes up. My personal feeling is that a (likely) Hillary victory in 2016 could see Cuomo moving into her administration which means the gubernatorial race will start early and no one will want to alienate any potential union backing.

The state is doing pretty well right now so the revenue promises aren't likely to win too many people over. Also the UFC's court troubles are probably only going to get worse next year which will vindicate some of the opposition.

I believe 2017 to be the year. I'd love to be wrong and see a sudden reversal of fortune, but I also feel the UFC trying to stage an event under alternate sanctioning will force a confrontation that will be ill timed. I think that strategy is mostly a bluff as well.
 

kneeblock

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I think the NY area is a different animal. I was at UFC 159 Jones vs Sonnen in Newark,NJ which is 10 miles from NYC and a short train ride away. He was heavily booed during his entrance. I'm not sure the ppl of NYC would give Jones a hometown welcome.
Agreed. I was there too and several fights broke out. The energy in the crowd was anemic at best. It being a bad show didn't help.
 

CaffeineBomb

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Sep 8, 2015
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I'm not sure if DC really did have huge objections to fighting in NYC. What I do know is that within a week or two of saying that he did so he was cleared to take a break after a killer year and had signed a brand new contract with the UFC he's apparently very happy with.

We're also all still talking about him saying he wouldn't fight Jones there and about MMA in NYC, keeping both the fight and the issue that the UFC cares about in the news cycle and helping build hype for the fight wherever they end up fighting.