Society Yanez NOT GUILTY in Philando Castile shooting

[Yossarian]

I do the same.

All windows down.
Interior lights on if at night.
Car off, keys on dash.
Hands on wheel.
Let him know I need to get my license from my pocket/glovebox/etc then await the affirmative.

But that's the best way IMO. I'm not afraid of cops. But I try to put them at ease when I'm pulled over.

But I also am thinking about the huge gap from that to shooting someone.

But at what point does the police protect and serve, and at what point are they like crime, just another threat to your well-being? We have cops around so we don't get shot at, but we risk getting shot at in order to feel safe.

When I get pulled over I do listen to verbal commands, and ask if I can get my wallet. One time I got pulled over and I grabbed my wallet for it to be ready, and while doing so I undid my seatbelt. I got a ticket for that seatbelt. So yeah, when the police pulls you over, consider yourself fucked, and do NOT ever trust that officer.

 

[Splinty]

But at what point does the police protect and serve, and at what point are they like crime, just another threat to your well-being? We have cops around so we don't get shot at, but we risk getting shot at in order to feel safe.

Hence my statement...

But I also am thinking about the huge gap from that to shooting someone.

You do realize thus far I don't think the shooting was justified, right?

 

[Yossarian]

Hence my statement...

But I also am thinking about the huge gap from that to shooting someone.

You do realize thus far I don't think the shooting was justified, right?

Yes, I got that far.

Just adding my two cents, not arguing your stance.

 

[Splinty]

Yes, I got that far.

Just adding my two cents, not arguing your stance.

Lol seems we are just talking past each other agreeing

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

If he hadn't notified the officer of his firearm would it have been okay to reach for his pocket?

Apparently Minnesota is not a required notification state. That is you do not have to voluntarily tell an officer you have it concealed carry weapon unless you are asked.

With that bit of knowledge I'm even less impressed by this cop. Here is somebody notifying you of a weapon when they are not legally required to.

For perspective, we're generally told here not to volunteer that we have a firearm in our vehicle if pulled over as it really only serves to make the officer uncomfortable.

 

[Splinty]

For perspective, we're generally told here not to volunteer that we have a firearm in our vehicle if pulled over as it really only serves to make the officer uncomfortable.

That's interesting. We have many states that required to tell the officer and others and what you don't have to tell them but it will show up connected to your license plate so they know.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

That's interesting. We have many states that required to tell the officer and others and what you don't have to tell them but it will show up connected to your license plate so they know.

Up here the answer is "it depends" some people swear up and down that whether or not you have a firearms license pops up when your plate is run, others swear up and down that they have no idea. For me personally, I don't care whether they know or not. The simple policy as far as I'm concerned is 1) Keep your hands on the steering wheel. 2) Don't lie to a cop. 3) Don't volunteer information unless asked about it. 4) Do what they tell you, not what you think you should do. (Yes, that includes the cop telling me to do something and then changing his mind) If I'm wronged, my lawyer will be more than happy to deal with it on my behalf at a later date.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

He was following police commands

Then why did the officer need to tell him 3 times "Don't reach for it"?

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

He was asked to get his ID.

and was almost immediately told not to reach for it.

 

[Filthy]

Then why did the officer need to tell him 3 times "Don't reach for it"?

Because Castile thought the officer was telling him not to reach for the weapon, which he was not doing.

"Don't Move"
"Don't Reach For Your Pocket"
"Freeze!"
"Hands UP!"

those are unambiguous commands.

"Don't reach for it" is pretty ambiguous if you're willing to shoot an innocent man and negligently endanger a child over a misinterpretation.

 

[Filthy]

and was almost immediately told not to reach for it.

And Castile replied, calmly "I'm not"

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

"Don't reach for it" is pretty ambiguous if you're willing to shoot an innocent man.

What could "it" be? His gun? His wallet? Does it matter? He was given a clear command to stop reaching, he didn't comply. The officer did what he felt he needed to do in order to protect his life.

And Castile replied, calmly "I'm not"

As he continued reaching.

If you were in Castille's place and told "Don't reach for it!" would you have kept going for your pocket or lifted your hands into plain sight?

 

[Filthy]

What could "it" be? His gun? His wallet? Does it matter? He was given a clear command to stop reaching, he didn't comply. The officer did what he felt he needed to do in order to protect his life.



As he continued reaching.

If you were in Castille's place and told "Don't reach for it!" would you have kept going for your pocket or lifted your hands into plain sight?

Bullshit. Why is the onus on Castile to correctly interpret the commands? Why isn't the responsibility on the professional to issue clear commands?

The officer created the situation through his incompetence, then over-reacted due irrational fears.

Go To Prison.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

Why is the onus on Castile to correctly interpret the commands?

Because he was being detained at the time.

Why isn't the responsibility on the professional to issue clear commands?

"Don't reach for it" is pretty clear to me.

The officer created the situation through his incompetence

Agree

then over-reacted due irrational fears.

Over reaction, yes, but suspect wasn't complying to his commands.

Go To Prison.

Apparently not.

 

[Filthy]

 

[drjones]

Bullshit. Why is the onus on Castile to correctly interpret the commands? Why isn't the responsibility on the professional to issue clear commands?

The officer created the situation through his incompetence, then over-reacted due irrational fears.

Go To Prison.

he followed every command given to him, i guess people think if they just keep saying that he didnt eventually it will become true. imagine what they would be claiming if there was no videotape eh?

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

he followed every command given to him, i guess people think if they just keep saying that he didnt eventually it will become true. imagine what they would be claiming if there was no videotape eh?

Do you really not understand the difference between a police officer being charged with manslaughter for actions in the line of duty and an average citizen? Putting your hands over your ears and yelling doesn't make anything. I have asked every single poster in this thread who thinks Yanez should be locked up what they would do if told "Don't reach for it!" Every single one has refused to answer the question and instead substituted a rhetoric filled response about "He shouldn't have to". The elephant in the room is when you're told don't reach, you stop fucking reaching. If he had he wouldn't be dead.

Fucking LOL @ Trevor Noah "He had done nothing wrong"

 

[Filthy]

Do you really not understand the difference between a police officer being charged with manslaughter for actions in the line of duty and an average citizen? Putting your hands over your ears and yelling doesn't make anything. I have asked every single poster in this thread who thinks Yanez should be locked up what they would do if told "Don't reach for it!" Every single one has refused to answer the question and instead substituted a rhetoric filled response about "He shouldn't have to". The elephant in the room is when you're told don't reach, you stop fucking reaching. If he had he wouldn't be dead.

Fucking LOL @ Trevor Noah "He had done nothing wrong"

What would you do?
I'll tell you what you'd do - you have no fucking idea. The officer issued an ambiguous command, the victim (in a car with his wife and child, having informed the officer of a legally concealed firearm) replied calmly that he wasn't reaching for the weapon. His girlfriend testified that he stopped reaching in to his pocket when the officer commanded, but that it 'stuck' as he was taking it out to the show the officer.

The officer, having given unclear instructions, assumed the worst despite all available evidence, and sentenced an innocent man to death. That's what happened, and you're apparently OK with that. Why? Because you're not black? Because your passenger won't have a minuscule amount of a forbidden plant in their possession?

Pray that you don't misinterpret what the cop wants you to do. It's a split-second response, and if you get it wrong you get dead.
And the cop walks free.

 

[KWingJitsu]

For perspective, we're generally told here not to volunteer that we have a firearm in our vehicle if pulled over as it really only serves to make the officer uncomfortable.

Where's 'here'?

Here (Cali), we're told to tell 'em.
Riding with my friend who did, and the officer was quick to let us go even though he pulled him over for speeding.
He told me that's why he likes to carry - because every time he gets pulled over, he says "Officer, I have a licensed weapon on me".
Says 100% of the time cops can't be arsed to do anything and always let him go.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

What would you do?
I'll tell you what you'd do - you have no fucking idea.

I've been pulled over before. I know what I've done in those instances, so I actually have a pretty good idea of what I'd do. Nice avoidance of the question yet again though.

The officer issued an ambiguous command, the victim (in a car with his wife and child, having informed the officer of a legally concealed firearm) replied calmly that he wasn't reaching for the weapon.

So we're applying a line of reason where if during a traffic stop a cop issues a command and you aren't sure what he means you should just continue as you were?

His girlfriend testified that he stopped reaching in to his pocket when the officer commanded, but that it 'stuck' as he was taking it out to the show the officer.

So she testified that his hand was in his pocket when the cop told him not to reach for it.

That's what happened, and you're apparently OK with that. Why?

If you can show me anywhere that I've indicated I'm okay with how this officer handled the situation I'd like to see it because I'm not in the least. The really angry people in this thread seem unable to disassociate me being okay with how the jury reached their decision to acquit with me being okay with what happened that afternoon.

Here's what a juror said when asked about how they researched their decision:

"What happened to Philando is not OK to any of us. Nobody felt good about any part of this," the juror said. "We were just asked to do a job and we did it, and I think every one of us is proud of how we acted, but nobody felt good. Nobody was OK with it."

"What we were looking at was some pretty obscure things to a lot of people, like culpable negligence. You think you might know what it means: It's negligent, but maybe pretty bad negligence. Well, it's gross negligence with an element of recklessness ... We had the law in front of us so we could break it down."

"It just came down to us not being able to see what was going on in the car. Some of us were saying that there was some recklessness there, but that didn't stick because we didn't know what escalated the situation: was he really seeing a gun? We felt [Yanez] was an honest guy ... and in the end, we had to go on his word, and that's what it came down to."

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

Where's 'here'?

Canada.

 

[drjones]

But at what point does the police protect and serve, and at what point are they like crime, just another threat to your well-being?

well obviously that depends on who is getting shot and who is doing the shooting.

 

[DiSmAnTLeR]

Up here the answer is "it depends" some people swear up and down that whether or not you have a firearms license pops up when your plate is run, others swear up and down that they have no idea. For me personally, I don't care whether they know or not. The simple policy as far as I'm concerned is 1) Keep your hands on the steering wheel. 2) Don't lie to a cop. 3) Don't volunteer information unless asked about it. 4) Do what they tell you, not what you think you should do. (Yes, that includes the cop telling me to do something and then changing his mind) If I'm wronged, my lawyer will be more than happy to deal with it on my behalf at a later date.

Firearm licensing information is available through the CPIC database.

Canadian Police Information Centre - Wikipedia

When I'm pulled over. I shut off the vehicle, keep my seatbelt on and hands visible. I only provide them my documents after they ask and I don't answer questions. If they ask if it's my current address, I reply with 'do you have reason to believe that it's not?'

 

[drjones]

"do you have reason to believe that it's not?"

sounds like somebody is looking to get themselves shot...

 

[DiSmAnTLeR]

"do you have reason to believe that it's not?"

sounds like somebody is looking to get themselves shot...

Maybe in whatever hellhole you are from, but you have to do a little more than that to get shot here in Canada.