General You live in a BIG american city ?

Welcome to our Community
Wanting to join the rest of our members? Feel free to Sign Up today.
Sign up

tang

top korean roofer
Oct 21, 2015
9,398
12,402
I think they're protesting but not articulating very well what they perceive to be a racism problem with police across the country. I believe in what they're protesting, but I also think it's a larger issue. Much like they have found that priesthood seems to attract deviants and are trying to put more checks in place, policing seems to attract a certain type of person.

I think one of the biggest problems is that the police have a systemic culture of covering for each other rather than policing each other. It makes sense in the context of how easy it would be for fellow officers to decide not to back you up when you need it, or the partner relationship. But that culture is passe and it's time to accept that with modernity comes better communications, more of these activities coming to light, and the need for a top-down, heavily trained and enforced cultural change.

I mean, the need has been there for a long time, but I just don't think they can get away with not addressing it anymore.

Just imo.

It would be interesting to see what training and checks the Catholic church is working on adding and to see if the general strategies have been successful and could be applied to police misconduct and reporting culture.
but why the violence? and stealing? innocent people's shit? it feels like an isolated incident, thousands miles away from most people who are protesting, I don't get it.

I'm not saying any side is doing the right thing but all these violence kind of reinforces the reason for cops to be even more trigger happy imo.

is it the question of which came first chicken or the egg?
in this case, are the cops are trigger happy because of the violent area that they work in or trigger happy cops made everyone more violent?

to me, this is just like one of those mass-shooting incidents, where because of a fraction of the percentage of individuals, the law-abiding masses have to pay for it. in this case, even if you're a good cop, you'd be labeled as same as that Chauvin guy in everyone's eyes... angry protesters throw shit at the cops who are doing their job... cops then retaliate with force... innocent people get caught in the middle... someone post on social media... more people get angry saying, "this is why..." crazy domino effect
 

Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,835
You suprise me Filthy, you want this race war that is being forced down your neck by your shit media machine, you want the police removed, what happens then, you get fucking South Africa, people with money are safe and fuck everyone else.

Thats what you are calling for
well, I have money.

so fuck everyone else.
 

Filthy

Iowa Wrestling Champion
Jun 28, 2016
27,507
29,835
but why the violence? and stealing? innocent people's shit? it feels like an isolated incident, thousands miles away from most people who are protesting, I don't get it.

I'm not saying any side is doing the right thing but all these violence kind of reinforces the reason for cops to be even more trigger happy imo.

is it the question of which came first chicken or the egg?
in this case, are the cops are trigger happy because of the violent area that they work in or trigger happy cops made everyone more violent?

to me, this is just like one of those mass-shooting incidents, where because of a fraction of the percentage of individuals, the law-abiding masses have to pay for it. in this case, even if you're a good cop, you'd be labeled as same as that Chauvin guy in everyone's eyes... angry protesters throw shit at the cops who are doing their job... cops then retaliate with force... innocent people get caught in the middle... someone post on social media... more people get angry saying, "this is why..." crazy domino effect
you have to remember that there are sub-groups not affiliated with this injustice who feel like their causes are advanced by violence - both the far-left "overthrow the bourgeious" collectivists and the "Jesus Loves Law & Order" free-range idiots on the far-right. Add to this mix a bunch of people who have been told that their humanity is tied to the their social status, and you have all the ingredients for violence and looting on the periphery of peaceful protests. It certainly doesn't help when the police and Feds have agent provocateurs in place for the purpose of initiating violence on crowds, or that AntiFa-social types are walking around smashing windows and hurling rocks.

Also, extremely disappointed in the POTUS hiding in the basement during all of this. Pathetic excuse for leadership.
 

tang

top korean roofer
Oct 21, 2015
9,398
12,402
you have to remember that there are sub-groups not affiliated with this injustice who feel like their causes are advanced by violence - both the far-left "overthrow the bourgeious" collectivists and the "Jesus Loves Law & Order" free-range idiots on the far-right. Add to this mix a bunch of people who have been told that their humanity is tied to the their social status, and you have all the ingredients for violence and looting on the periphery of peaceful protests. It certainly doesn't help when the police and Feds have agent provocateurs in place for the purpose of initiating violence on crowds, or that AntiFa-social types are walking around smashing windows and hurling rocks.

Also, extremely disappointed in the POTUS hiding in the basement during all of this. Pathetic excuse for leadership.
this is straight a war zone, reminds me of Iraq. at first, the troops were there to win the hearts and minds until one individual fuck shit up with a war crime, then the local populace perceives every troops as the aggressors and attack the troops, then the locals escalate shit and we had Fallujah 1 and 2, people will die and things will settle for little bit, but as soon as something happens again, it'll be same shit all over again. There will be no end.
I guess the best solution for Iraq was that we shouldn't have been there the first place, but after we're there, it's even more wrong to just leave, which we did and created more instability.

As for the US, we can't live without laws, and even if the cops who committed the crimes are disciplined, somebody else in the future will do the same thing. so how do we fix this?

POTUS is probably hiding because of the secret service protocols but you're right. POTUS need to step up some how and play mediator to all this. but would that even work? when there's always rogue individuals fucking shit up for the rest of us
 

nuraknu

savage
Jul 20, 2016
6,247
10,770
but why the violence? and stealing? innocent people's shit? it feels like an isolated incident, thousands miles away from most people who are protesting, I don't get it.

I'm not saying any side is doing the right thing but all these violence kind of reinforces the reason for cops to be even more trigger happy imo.

is it the question of which came first chicken or the egg?
in this case, are the cops are trigger happy because of the violent area that they work in or trigger happy cops made everyone more violent?

to me, this is just like one of those mass-shooting incidents, where because of a fraction of the percentage of individuals, the law-abiding masses have to pay for it. in this case, even if you're a good cop, you'd be labeled as same as that Chauvin guy in everyone's eyes... angry protesters throw shit at the cops who are doing their job... cops then retaliate with force... innocent people get caught in the middle... someone post on social media... more people get angry saying, "this is why..." crazy domino effect
Peaceful protesting did not work. But at the same time, based on all the different videos I've seen, I think there are some genuine incidents that blew up (whether initially the fault of a protester or police since we have seen both), some deliberate incitement by both organized and disorganized parties with their own agendas, and teens or disturbed adults that are just getting set off by it all.

The videos we have seen might be skewed by the fact that the orchestrated events would have had planned recording, but all I can say from what I've seen of what I believe to be orchestrated and what I believe to be real unplanned events, is that everything that every group accuses another of doing is TRUE. The president is not leading well through this, the state and local leaders are flat out lying, the police are racist, the blacks are looting, the whites are looting, the blacks are causing violent incidents, the whites are causing violent incidents and starting trouble where they're not wanted, the police are deliberately inciting violence both undercover and with their violent militaristic tactics, antifa people are going too far, people are traveling to other places to start shit, locals are trashing their own neighborhoods, the police are targeting members of the media and shooting out eyeballs with rubber bullets, other members of the media are skewing reports and possibly even staging certain events, Alex Jones is now being accused of having his staff set the homeless man's belongings on fire, etc.

The other side of it is also true. There are some amazing, brave, and well-spoken local leaders who to my knowledge haven't lied. There are some amazing, brave, compassionate police officers. There are good, genuine protesters stopping looters and violent troublemakers. There are white people jumping between the police and black people to protect them. The are some amazing, brave media members who are genuinely trying to document and report true happenings. And there are even people who have had good experiences with antifa and actually appreciate that antifa are ready to mix it up on their behalf, that someone is willing to fight a real fight if it comes down to it.

The reason imo is that every profession and every race has good people, bad people, disturbed people, confused people, etc. And we are seeing all of it very publicly and intensely across the country right now.

The looters are really just grotesque to me -- I feel like so many people, political groups, etc. are opportunists right now, and their opportunism is just the most obvious. Most of the looting vids I saw were not people protesting, but people calmly walking into stores and outright shoplifting tons of stuff basically. It's a lack of moral fiber. I wish I could excuse it Inot really an excuse but some kind of mob-mentality reason) as people with less money getting fed up and taking what they need, but most seem to just be calmly taking stuff out of greed.

OTOH, I saw another opinion today which is yet another side of the situation -- that a lot of the people involved may not feel engaged with or part of their communities. They make $7.25/hour, can't buy homes only rent, etc. So trashing their own neighborhood doesn't really mean as much to them.

I guess my answer is, I don't know.

But anyway every side and every accusation and every good thing all seem to be true, at least based on what I've seen.
 

tang

top korean roofer
Oct 21, 2015
9,398
12,402
Peaceful protesting did not work. But at the same time, based on all the different videos I've seen, I think there are some genuine incidents that blew up (whether initially the fault of a protester or police since we have seen both), some deliberate incitement by both organized and disorganized parties with their own agendas, and teens or disturbed adults that are just getting set off by it all.

The videos we have seen might be skewed by the fact that the orchestrated events would have had planned recording, but all I can say from what I've seen of what I believe to be orchestrated and what I believe to be real unplanned events, is that everything that every group accuses another of doing is TRUE. The president is not leading well through this, the state and local leaders are flat out lying, the police are racist, the blacks are looting, the whites are looting, the blacks are causing violent incidents, the whites are causing violent incidents and starting trouble where they're not wanted, the police are deliberately inciting violence both undercover and with their violent militaristic tactics, antifa people are going too far, people are traveling to other places to start shit, locals are trashing their own neighborhoods, the police are targeting members of the media and shooting out eyeballs with rubber bullets, other members of the media are skewing reports and possibly even staging certain events, Alex Jones is now being accused of having his staff set the homeless man's belongings on fire, etc.

The other side of it is also true. There are some amazing, brave, and well-spoken local leaders who to my knowledge haven't lied. There are some amazing, brave, compassionate police officers. There are good, genuine protesters stopping looters and violent troublemakers. There are white people jumping between the police and black people to protect them. The are some amazing, brave media members who are genuinely trying to document and report true happenings. And there are even people who have had good experiences with antifa and actually appreciate that antifa are ready to mix it up on their behalf, that someone is willing to fight a real fight if it comes down to it.

The reason imo is that every profession and every race has good people, bad people, disturbed people, confused people, etc. And we are seeing all of it very publicly and intensely across the country right now.

The looters are really just grotesque to me -- I feel like so many people, political groups, etc. are opportunists right now, and their opportunism is just the most obvious. Most of the looting vids I saw were not people protesting, but people calmly walking into stores and outright shoplifting tons of stuff basically. It's a lack of moral fiber. I wish I could excuse it Inot really an excuse but some kind of mob-mentality reason) as people with less money getting fed up and taking what they need, but most seem to just be calmly taking stuff out of greed.

OTOH, I saw another opinion today which is yet another side of the situation -- that a lot of the people involved may not feel engaged with or part of their communities. They make $7.25/hour, can't buy homes only rent, etc. So trashing their own neighborhood doesn't really mean as much to them.

I guess my answer is, I don't know.

But anyway every side and every accusation and every good thing all seem to be true, at least based on what I've seen.
good stuff. I wish more people (including myself) could think like you