Your thoughts on open carry?

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Are you for or against it?

  • For it

    Votes: 12 50.0%
  • Against it

    Votes: 12 50.0%

  • Total voters
    24

Greenbean

Posting Machine
Nov 14, 2015
2,864
4,187
Well exactly how common is it to find yourself in a situation involving a gunfight right now? We're asking millions to arm themselves for a situation they will most likely never be in and then expecting that we're going to have Nirvana after the fact.

America isn't the place people are going to behave with more weapons.
No one is asking millions to arm themselves. Well there might be some calling for that, but not me. If you don't want a gun, you shouldn't be forced to own one. If you want a gun and have proven to be mentally capable of ownership, I don't think you should have that right taken away.
 

Greenbean

Posting Machine
Nov 14, 2015
2,864
4,187
No one is asking millions to arm themselves. Well there might be some calling for that, but not me. If you don't want a gun, you shouldn't be forced to own one. If you want a gun and have proven to be mentally capable of ownership, I don't think you should have that right taken away.
I'm personally against gun free zones.
 

SNIDELY WHIPLASH

DOOGOODER!!!!!!
Feb 16, 2015
1,643
2,186
No one is asking millions to arm themselves. Well there might be some calling for that, but not me. If you don't want a gun, you shouldn't be forced to own one. If you want a gun and have proven to be mentally capable of ownership, I don't think you should have that right taken away.
I have never advocated for guns to be taken away, only that the people who carry are as trained as people who drive cars.

My stance is that automatic weapons are a no no, home protection is a boon and certain places be off limits. But yes, half of the GOP card is calling for people to arm themselves.

I live in New York, I come from Brooklyn. I would NOT feel safe with a city full of people with guns, even if I had one.
 

Splinty

Shake 'em off
Admin
Dec 31, 2014
44,116
91,096
I'm almost positive we're saying the same thing. Maybe you can clarify so I can see if that's the case.

I'm only saying what I've already posted. I am asking questions. There's no implication. I have no idea what balance you are talking about.
 

SNIDELY WHIPLASH

DOOGOODER!!!!!!
Feb 16, 2015
1,643
2,186
I'm only saying what I've already posted. I am asking questions. There's no implication. I have no idea what balance you are talking about.
The balance I'm talking about is that guns appear to be in distinctly different camps right now.

You have criminals who get guns and use them criminally.You have responsible owners who use them for their own purposes.

To me that seems like a 'balance' of sorts because we know what to expect.

What I'm worried about is when everybody decides they want to carry and all the incidents that stem from the idiots who aren't as careful as people who have owned them for years.
 

check it

kids need ninja shit too
Jul 23, 2015
4,407
7,450
What I'm worried about is when everybody decides they want to carry and all the incidents that stem from the idiots who aren't as careful as people who have owned them for years.
your worry is not unfounded. i'm in norfolk...and because i attend a university that sits in a high crime area...specifically prone to gun violence i got this email from the chief of police...looking for a solution to the problem.

NORFOLK INCIDENT NOTIFICATION: A MESSAGE FROM NORFOLK POLICE CHIEF GOLDSMITH

Posted on: October 31, 2015
Chief Goldsmith comments on recent violence

"Within one hour, my police department responded to two separate incidents early this morning. In both cases - two men lost their lives - two people were injured – all because two people chose to resolve an argument with a gun.

Shortly after 2:00 a.m., my officers responded to a call for a possible gunshot victim in the 3900 block of E. Princess Anne Road. We located a man suffering from an apparent gunshot wound.
The man was immediately transported to Sentara Norfolk General Hospital where he was pronounced dead shortly after arrival.

As my detectives conducted their preliminary investigation, two men were located suffering from gunshot wounds, one of which remains in serious condition. It was determined all three were shot during the same incident.

Almost one hour later, Norfolk dispatchers received a call for a person who may have been shot near the intersection of W. 35th Street and Killam Avenue. My officers discovered a man suffering from an apparent gunshot wound and arriving medics pronounced the man dead at the scene.

In both instances - these cases started as arguments that ended in gunfire. When did it become ok to solve a fight with a gun?

As a parent, I cannot fathom this inherent disregard for human life. As a Police Chief, I refuse to allow this mentality to become commonplace in our city.

My thoughts and prayers are with the family members who now suffer the loss of their loved ones. To those families, the criminals responsible for these incidents will be found. They will be charged and justice will be served.

To our Norfolk community, the work extends beyond my Detective Division. All 745 police officers will continue to do their job. Now it's time for the 245,000 people living in this city to do theirs. We need your help.

My police officers cannot work alone. I call for Norfolk’s community members to take a stand against violence. We all have a social responsibility to guide our youth and prevent these senseless acts from becoming a permanent fixture in our society.

Tolerating this behavior is a gateway to acceptance. I will never accept this way of life and neither should you.

Tonight is Halloween. We know there will be parties. I'm asking the community for their help. If you plan to host a house party - let us know and we'll support you. Concerned about one in your neighborhood? Call us. You can remain anonymous. One call may prevent a situation from turning worse.

Norfolk is a resilient community. We are a city of neighborhoods. Get to know your neighbor. Get involved. The city has programs, hosts community events - come to one. Call 664-6510 and ask for information. We all deserve to live in safe, healthy and inclusive communities.

Norfolk is not alone dealing with the issue of gun violence, but we have the ingenuity to fight it. We are a city of creative and collaborative people who come together to solve our issues. Acts of violence in one neighborhood should affect us all. Working collaboratively is the only way to find solutions and support each other so we can come back stronger."

-Police Chief Michael Goldsmith
 

maurice

Posting Machine
Oct 21, 2015
1,361
2,295
If only the most trained people in Chicago could have guns in public, then the police would be unarmed. They have to go to the range only once per year and receive no continuing firearms training. That would make them far less trained than most people with concealed carry permits.

What do these states have in common? What balance are you talking about?

Map doesn't pass the smell test. They apparently are comparing the gun ownership rate with the total number of deaths. You need to compare rates to rates and totals to totals. Of course the big empty states have a low number of total deaths compared to California. They have a fraction of California's population.
 

Splinty

Shake 'em off
Admin
Dec 31, 2014
44,116
91,096
Map doesn't pass the smell test. They apparently are comparing the gun ownership rate with the total number of deaths. You need to compare rates to rates and totals to totals. Of course the big empty states have a low number of total deaths compared to California. They have a fraction of California's population.

That is not true at all.

..the firearm death rate statistic is from 2004 and is not measured in terms of total deaths; it has been normalized by population (i.e., deaths per 100,000). It includes only firearm homicides, not suicides or accidental deaths.


So yes, rate and rate.


The point of the map is that there is no commonality. New york and calofornia, low ownership, different outcome. Mississippi and Louisiana top 10 flanked by similar ownership states...not top ten.

The entire point is the opposite of what you concluded. It does not conclude a linear preference for rural states. It shows a hodge podge of LACK of said trend.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,549
56,270
Reasons for concealed carry:

  • Creates a situation of unknown for criminals. This is both beneficial at the individual and population level.
  • Requires significant background checks and processing, leading to CHL holders being well below the average for gun crime.
  • Maintains that my gun ownership is my business and yours is yours. Those that don't own guns are not involved in this personal choice.
Reasons 1 and 3 work equally against concealed carry. It also creates a situation of unknown for law abiding citizens, which is incredibly unfair to those not carrying. Public safety is no one's choice and everyone's responsibility, and firearm handling falls directly under the heading of "safety". If someone is going to carry a firearm for protecting themselves and others, I think they should be required to open carry making the public statement that "I am prepared to live and die by this thing on my hip". It's kind of absurd to me that people want to protect themselves, but only at their own convenience. The idea of casual CCW completely flies in the face of the 2nd amendment.

It's also baffling to me that background checks aren't required to purchase firearms.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,549
56,270
But that's NOT the statement that gun owners or carriers should be making. Why would you want that as the culture?



Wut?
Yes, it is.

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

For what it's worth we're talking about carriers, not owners.
 

Greenbean

Posting Machine
Nov 14, 2015
2,864
4,187
It's also baffling to me that background checks aren't required to purchase firearms.
I hear this a lot, and the so called gun show loophole, but every gun that I've purchased, I've had a background check done on me. Everyone that I know that has a gun, it was purchased legally and had a background check done on them.
 

Splinty

Shake 'em off
Admin
Dec 31, 2014
44,116
91,096
Yes, it is.

"A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."

For what it's worth we're talking about carriers, not owners.

What does that have to do with wanting my carrying of a gun to be a public statement? I don't live by my guns. Why do you think I should tell people I do?

Everyone that I know that has a gun, it was purchased legally and had a background check done on them.
I own two guns that were direct purchases and require no background.
 
M

member 1013

Guest
I asked some Americans once and at first the laughed and called me retarded but then they didn't know, but can you wear sweet shit like a sword or maybe carry a halberd in open carry States?

Cause I would do that. Fuck I would be so cool.
 

Greenbean

Posting Machine
Nov 14, 2015
2,864
4,187
What does that have to do with wanting my carrying of a gun to be a public statement? I don't live by my guns. Why do you think I should tell people I do?



I own two guns that were direct purchases and require no background.
I must be doing it wrong then. I'm not saying either of you are lying, just that this is different in my experience. Why is that? State laws or were you buying long guns? Is that the difference? Because I think long gun purchase is different than handguns. I don't really know. All I know is my experience required background checks
 

Γαλάνης

The Wallabee Champ
First 100
Jan 18, 2015
3,657
4,963
Personally I'm not a fan of open carry

Go watch any of those open carry demonstrations where neck bearded geeks walk around in the street with rifles strapped to their back

It does nothing but make innocent people nervous who are unfortunate enough to share a public space with these people. However, I do NOT believe we should have our rights taken away, I am all for concealed carry, and the right to bear arms. I just don't think every jack off should be allowed to walk around with a gun openly on their waste wherever they want.

Obviously not every single person doing this is an untrained goofball, but far too many of them are, and there are plenty of people who don't want to be shopping at a mall for example and see some random person - who is not in anyway an officer of the law or an authority figure - walking around making it clear to everyone near him he is armed.

You can be armed, but you don't need to announce it to everyone around you 24/7 if you're just a regular citizen. Just my 2 cents.
 

Γαλάνης

The Wallabee Champ
First 100
Jan 18, 2015
3,657
4,963
Also, I don't think it'd be a deterrent to a mass shooter. If someone is crazy enough to do that in the first place, they are prepared to die, and would more than likely just target the open carrier first.

Whereas if someone was there with concealed carry, perhaps that person would have enough time - and not be noticed - to get in position to take the shooter out.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,549
56,270
Personally I'm not a fan of open carry

Go watch any of those open carry demonstrations where neck bearded geeks walk around in the street with rifles strapped to their back

It does nothing but make innocent people nervous who are unfortunate enough to share a public space with these people. However, I do NOT believe we should have our rights taken away, I am all for concealed carry, and the right to bear arms. I just don't think every jack off should be allowed to walk around with a gun openly on their waste wherever they want.

Obviously not every single person doing this is an untrained goofball, but far too many of them are, and there are plenty of people who don't want to be shopping at a mall for example and see some random person - who is not in anyway an officer of the law or an authority figure - walking around making it clear to everyone near him he is armed.

You can be armed, but you don't need to announce it to everyone around you 24/7 if you're just a regular citizen. Just my 2 cents.
How does concealing the weapon mitigate any of your concerns?
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,549
56,270
Also, I don't think it'd be a deterrent to a mass shooter. If someone is crazy enough to do that in the first place, they are prepared to die, and would more than likely just target the open carrier first.

Whereas if someone was there with concealed carry, perhaps that person would have enough time - and not be noticed - to get in position to take the shooter out.
Is there extensive training for that type of situation when someone is given a concealed carry permit?
 

Γαλάνης

The Wallabee Champ
First 100
Jan 18, 2015
3,657
4,963
Do I really need to explain that?

You don't see the difference with someone walking around with a gun for everyone to see, and someone keeping it concealed?
 

Γαλάνης

The Wallabee Champ
First 100
Jan 18, 2015
3,657
4,963
I never ever post in any type of political threads on here or any other forum because they are just endless back and forths, people arguing etc. People going back and forth - but why? It's not like an internet debate or argument over politics or things like this are actually going to change the way other people think. Like no one who is for or against something is going to read the posts of another internet user and go, wow he is right, I was wrong, my mind has changed.

I am not looking to change anyone's mind. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion and to think how they please. I'm not looking to change anyone's mind, I was just putting in my 2 cents on how I feel personally about any person in the world being allowed to walk around with firearms for the public to see in any type of environment. Not everyone is comfortable with that and rightfully so, IMO. Again, I am not against the right to bear arms AT ALL - it is our constitutional right. Taking away guns will never be the answer. But I don't see the point in walking around with them openly unless you are an officer of the law, a private security contractor etc, or your job requires you to do so.

I don't expect my post to change the way people feel about open carry and that was not my intention. I was just commenting on the subject.

I also believe a lot of people who are obsessed with open carry and firearms in general seem to be just looking for an excuse to use their guns. A lot of the gun nuts I know seem desperate to shoot somebody for something one day, all the training they do etc, they are just dying to get that chance.

I am a proud firearm owner but I don't feel the need to walk around with them everywhere just like I don't feel the need to go around and wear a t shirt that says I KNOW HOW TO BOX, DON'T FUCK WITH ME. It's one thing to be confident and know you can handle yourself if shit goes down - whether with a firearm or not - but I don't think it's necessary to have to display that to the world 24/7 everywhere you go.

That's all. Just how I feel. Not how you feel or anyone else. Not looking to argue with anyone or change anyone's mind. That's just my opinion on the subject at hand that was posted and open for discussion

peace to all my TMMAC brothers.
 

BeardOfKnowledge

The Most Consistent Motherfucker You Know
Jul 22, 2015
60,549
56,270
Do I really need to explain that?

You don't see the difference with someone walking around with a gun for everyone to see, and someone keeping it concealed?
I asked how that mitigates a safety concern, not how it challenges peoples visual conceptions of firearms.