"If you don't vote you can't complain!"

[Wintermute]

Of course I can, it's my first amendment right.

Convince me I should, or should not, vote if I don't actually endorse any candidate for president, TMMAC! I'm all ears.

 

[ThatOneDude]

I'm going to probably catch shit for this but here goes. Yes it is your right not exercise or exercise your right to vote. That being said, if you do not vote, you really can't/shouldn't complain because you have consciously decided to take yourself out of the process and are just complaining without even making the most minimal effort to participate.

You say you don't like any of the candidates so far. Have you looked into 3rd party candidates? Maybe you'll like one of them better. Hell you could even write in yourself and still be apart of the process without giving a vote to any candidate that you don't like or support.

Now I wait for the comments about how our votes don't matter, so I'm wrong.

 

[Wintermute]

Votes not mattering is too easy, but how about this:

I go to buy a car. The dealer has 1 red car and 1 blue car. They're essentially the same car. So I say, "I don't want either of these cars, I want an orange car." The dealer then says, "Here, you get the red car." Now I have to drive around a car I didn't even want, but I have to have a car. I have to get to work. I'm stuck with the problems the red car has.

 

[Simpleman]

ALOT of people in this country take the right to vote granted. Look at a history book for all of 5 minutes and realize how ridiculously self centered this is. People have literally died for the right to vote (and in some countries still are) ,but now some people can't drive or walk down the block to cast their vote. Drive for a half hour for a burger = sure why not. Stand in line for 5-10 minutes to cast a vote in an election = too busy/lazy/stupid. Im not saying you are, its just a general assessment of the public at large and it irritates the piss out of me. I'll get off my soap box now...

 

[Wintermute]

Is the value of an uninformed or misinformed vote greater than the value of not voting out of protest? Should citizens vote just to vote because it's their right? Or should they only vote if they're informed enough to do so?

 

[SNIDELY WHIPLASH]

I'm going to probably catch shit for this but here goes. Yes it is your right not exercise or exercise your right to vote. That being said, if you do not vote, you really can't/shouldn't complain because you have consciously decided to take yourself out of the process and are just complaining without even making the most minimal effort to participate.

You say you don't like any of the candidates so far. Have you looked into 3rd party candidates? Maybe you'll like one of them better. Hell you could even write in yourself and still be apart of the process without giving a vote to any candidate that you don't like or support.

Now I wait for the comments about how our votes don't matter, so I'm wrong.

I agree with this. The Internet is the greatest example of people complaining with no end in mind. Do SOMETHING besides complain, make some kind of effort.

 

[Priziesthorse]

The world is full of complainers when it should be full of doers.

 

[ThatOneDude]

Is the value of an uninformed or misinformed vote greater than the value of not voting out of protest? Should citizens vote just to vote because it's their right? Or should they only vote if they're informed enough to do so?

That's really a whole different topic. That's more of a "should we restrict certain people's right to vote" convo

 

[Simpleman]

Is the value of an uninformed or misinformed vote greater than the value of not voting out of protest? Should citizens vote just to vote because it's their right? Or should they only vote if they're informed enough to do so?

I am torn... I would just hope that people would inform themselves enough to know the basics but I already know the answer to that...
I guess in that aspect it's a good thing that some people are to lazy to vote.
This is why I think everyone should have to live outside their own country for a week in a non-vacation spot.

 

[ThatOneDude]

Votes not mattering is too easy, but how about this:

I go to buy a car. The dealer has 1 red car and 1 blue car. They're essentially the same car. So I say, "I don't want either of these cars, I want an orange car." The dealer then says, "Here, you get the red car." Now I have to drive around a car I didn't even want, but I have to have a car. I have to get to work. I'm stuck with the problems the red car has.

But with America's smaller parties and even write in options you can have any car you want.

 

[lookoutawhale]

Votes not mattering is too easy, but how about this:

I go to buy a car. The dealer has 1 red car and 1 blue car. They're essentially the same car. So I say, "I don't want either of these cars, I want an orange car." The dealer then says, "Here, you get the red car." Now I have to drive around a car I didn't even want, but I have to have a car. I have to get to work. I'm stuck with the problems the red car has.

I agree with that. I dont think there should be political parties. I think it should just be individuals running.

That whole party format polarizes the nation and gets people in to bully other people in their political party to tow the party line.

A person in government should represent their people who elected them, whatever they feel and not align them self to a particular line of thinking in a party where it becomes only one of 2 choices.

 

[Psychotropic Wanderlust]

But with America's smaller parties and even write in options you can have any car you want.

not really, you can write down whatever car you want, but it will always be either the red or blue car. regardless of your actually wants.

 

[Wintermute]

not really, you can write down whatever car you want, but it will always be either the red or blue car. regardless of your actually wants.

Correct.

 

[Leigh]

Correct.

But at least you'd have more credibility for whinging about it

 

[Wintermute]

But at least you'd have more credibility for whinging about it

I'm guessing you mean "whining"- but how do you arrive at that logic? Does it make more sense for me to vote knowing it's rigged and likely doesn't matter?

The best argument so far is that at least I'd be DOING something instead of just complaining. But not voting and explaining why IS doing something. It's evangelical non-participation.

Again, this is abstentionism, not laziness.

 

[Leigh]

I'm guessing you mean "whining"- but how do you arrive at that logic? Does it make more sense for me to vote knowing it's rigged and likely doesn't matter?

The best argument so far is that at least I'd be DOING something instead of just complaining. But not voting and explaining why IS doing something. It's evangelical non-participation.

Again, this is abstentionism, not laziness.

No, I meant whinging.

 

[ThatOneDude]

I'm guessing you mean "whining"- but how do you arrive at that logic? Does it make more sense for me to vote knowing it's rigged and likely doesn't matter?

The best argument so far is that at least I'd be DOING something instead of just complaining. But not voting and explaining why IS doing something. It's evangelical non-participation.

Again, this is abstentionism, not laziness.

If you make a conscious decision to sit on the sidelines you really shouldn't complain. You aren't even making the most minimal of effort.

 

[Wintermute]

If you make a conscious decision to sit on the sidelines you really shouldn't complain. You aren't even making the most minimal of effort.

...for the record, I DO vote, I'm just playing Devil's advocate here, because I really don't have a logical argument to support it. It feels pointless in a presidential election, and honestly, it's MUCH easier for me to go and pull a lever than defend abstention.

 

[Wintermute]

actually this article defends abstentionism pretty well How to defend yourself as a non-voter - Sun Nation

 

[ThatOneDude]

actually this article defends abstentionism pretty well How to defend yourself as a non-voter - Sun Nation

But the UK doesn't count....

 

[Wintermute]

LOL

 

[Leigh]

...for the record, I DO vote, I'm just playing Devil's advocate here, because I really don't have a logical argument to support it. It feels pointless in a presidential election, and honestly, it's MUCH easier for me to go and pull a lever than defend abstention.

I understand what you're saying but if you care enough to complain, do something about it. Vote for a third party or run yourself. Otherwise it comes across as, "I don't like this but I'm not bothered enough to do anything about it"

 

[OhWhopDaChamp]

No, I meant whinging.

Agree. That's how it is supposed to be spelled! But they type American and speak Ebonics

 

[OhWhopDaChamp]

FYI I am now agreeing with anything Leigh says. He has reached Horsey status.

 

[Punch]

Voting for a figurehead of the corporate overlords doesn't impress me. Getting involved in your community and passing reform does.