Sports Charlie Hustle - Pete Rose dies at age 83
- Thread starter Wild
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MLB didn't do anything to him. He did it to himself.
Yeah, no one ever denies his greatness as a ballplayer. I got his book on hitting when i was 12 in little league, and it helped a ton...made better by ted williams book on hitting.
However, he was an arrogant prick and if he had admitted what he did before 2004, and showed the least amout of remorse or contriteness about what he did, instead of just doubling down on being the arrogant prick he always was.....things might have gone differently for him
He fucked up. Sure.
But they let him participate in MLB activities when it was convenient for them. MLB Network. All Century Team.
He's goung to get in. Probably 10 years or so down rhe line. Just a shame he'll never see it.
He didn't throw a game like the Black Sox in 1919. He bet on his team to win. Not excusung the behavior - but it's not apples to apples.
He never came across as an arrogant prick to me. Tough competitor. But asshole? Meh. I met him a few times - always a nice guy.
He did double down on the lie like a 10 year old - but whatever. Even after his confession he was his own worst enemy. I'm not necessarily disagreeing with you when you say it was his own fault - but I still think he deserved to see himself inducted.
Someone broke down all the games he bet on, and his coaching tendencies. It was a pattern that he would save his best players and relievers to use in the games he bet on, and use his poorer ones on games he did not.
So, while he did not bet against his own team which would lead to the possibility of throwing games, his gambling still influenced the way he managed, the players he used, and games that preceded or followed the games he was betting on.
The best way i can describe him is that he was an incredible ball player, but kind of a shitty human
A manager making questionable calls in games? Holy shit at that revelation. Haha.
Pete wasn't a great in-game manager.
What you are describing could simply be confirmation bias. All moves made by a manager can be questioned. If what you described is proof of influencing games to favor a bet placed, David Bell might be the most degenerate gambler of all time because nearly every game this year he made some "WTF" moves.
It's not...someone actually crunched the data lol. I'll try to bring it up.
If they could prove David Bell was gambling on his own games, then sure, you have a point.
Use common sense...you have a degenerate gambler betting on his own games, even though he knows what will happen to him if he's caught....that has the managerial control over the team and is ablet to make personnel decisions that influence the outcome of games.
He was pooling resources into the games that he knew he bet on and stacking his best pitchers on the days he was gambling.
I would have punched the dude right in his smug fucking face.
There's also files that apparently show he was betting on games as a player....not just as a manager
He SHOULD be in the hall. But the reason he's not is on him, not MLB. Betting on baseball as a player or manager is the death sentence.
OTL: Notebook shows Rose bet on MLB as player
He SHOULD be in the hall. But the reason he's not is on him, not MLB. Betting on baseball as a player or manager is the death sentence.
OTL: Notebook shows Rose bet on MLB as player
Confirmation bias. I could go back and find games he didn't bet on but still made WTF moves.
He was a flawed human. I won't say shitty. Flawed is more accurate.
Not confirmation bias. Occam's Razor.
It's confirmation bias to believe his gambling didn't affect his managerial decisions just because Rose said so. THere's no way it couldn't
They busted Joe Jackson for the same thing.
In the 1919 WS he hit .375 with 12 hits, 6 RBI, 5 runs scored, 3 dbls and 1 HR.
Obvious sandbag is obvious.
Also, MLB is hypocritical in that they allowed Ohtani to find a fall guy and sweep his gambling under the rug.
If his translator stole all this money from him to bet, where is the police report? Where is the legal case?
Yeah...that's never going to materialize is it
If his translator stole all this money from him to bet, where is the police report? Where is the legal case?
Yeah...that's never going to materialize is it
There's no way to prove it one way or the other. It certainly wasn't obvious at the time.
He fucked up. And he continued to be his own worst enemy after the fact.
I would have less issue letting Rose in than I would the steroid dudes - but I also think those guys should be in.
This paragraph from the link i shared is telling stuff.
There's a reason why the book detailing his betting as a player is sealed away, and immune from a FOIA request. They don't want anyone to see it.
"To Dowd, one of the most compelling elements of the newly uncovered evidence is that it supports the charge that Rose was betting with mob-connected bookies through Bertolini. Dowd's investigation had established that Rose was hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt at the time he was banished from the game.
"Bertolini nails down the connection to organized crime on Long Island and New York. And that is a very powerful problem," Dowd said. "[Ohio bookie] Ron Peters is a golf pro, so he's got other occupations. But the boys in New York are about breaking arms and knees.
"The implications for baseball are terrible. [The mob] had a mortgage on Pete while he was a player and manager."
There's a reason why the book detailing his betting as a player is sealed away, and immune from a FOIA request. They don't want anyone to see it.
"To Dowd, one of the most compelling elements of the newly uncovered evidence is that it supports the charge that Rose was betting with mob-connected bookies through Bertolini. Dowd's investigation had established that Rose was hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt at the time he was banished from the game.
"Bertolini nails down the connection to organized crime on Long Island and New York. And that is a very powerful problem," Dowd said. "[Ohio bookie] Ron Peters is a golf pro, so he's got other occupations. But the boys in New York are about breaking arms and knees.
"The implications for baseball are terrible. [The mob] had a mortgage on Pete while he was a player and manager."
They aren't going to kick the current-day Babe Ruth out of baseball.
NFL players have been suspended for gambling...all of this will be a growing snowball of a problem for professional sports, since sports gambling has been legalized, and the leagues are basically shilling for the gambling sites.
It's going to lead to degeneracy and fixed games (if it hasn't already *cough cough Chiefs cough cough*)
It's going to lead to degeneracy and fixed games (if it hasn't already *cough cough Chiefs cough cough*)
Meh.
Dowd:Rose = Stump:Cobb
Well - sort of. Al Stump made up everything about Cobb.
I don't discount that Pete broke the rules, but I also don't discount that Dowd is an asshole.
Fucking this all day
Players placing proxy bets in today's world is nearly impossible to police.
I think i still have Pete's book on hitting. It really WAS great.
Funny story, I got given it for my birthday and hit two homers in one game the game after i read it lol
Little league homers were the best.
Funny story, I got given it for my birthday and hit two homers in one game the game after i read it lol
Little league homers were the best.
The money can always be tracked. Seems like they are content to claim the translator stole it without Ohtani's knowledge. I cry bullshit on that one.