New Judging Guidelines

[Andrewsimar Palhardass]

"In addition to the rules changes, the ABC also adopted the Rules Committee’s recommendations for clarification on judging criteria. First and foremost, “Effective Striking/Grappling” is to be used as the first (and most frequently utilized) criteria for determining a round winner.

“Effect Aggressiveness” is the second tier of criteria and is “only to be assessed if Effective Striking/Grappling is 100 percent equal for both competitors.” Finally, “Fight Area Control” is the third tier of criteria and “is only to be assessed if Effective Striking/Grappling and Effective Aggressiveness are 100 percent equal for both competitors.”

Despite staunch New Jersey objection, Association of Boxing Commissions pass rules and regulation changes

Thanks to @nick diaz nut hugger for a link to an informative video
ABC body approves changes to MMA scoring criteria, new rules in landslide vote

I think all of these changes will be good for the sport, but the judging one is the most important in my opinion. Apparently they are pushing toward more 10-8 rounds (which we have already seen in recent events), and they are finally setting some guidelines as far as how to go forward. Big John was quoted as saying that there will be some 10-10 rounds in the future. The best source that I have found for all of these changes is Marc Raimondi's twitter @Marc_Raimondi. Sounds like New Jersey was the only dissenter. All of these changes are a long time coming. Apparently they are all going to adopt the early weigh ins, and they are going to wait to see how that effects everything before potentially adding more weight classes next year (which I am not crazy about, but I understand the need for).

Thoughts? What do you guys think is the next big, important rule change for MMA? What is the most pressing issue after those that were addressed today?

 

[Andrewsimar Palhardass]

For the record, the article that I shared doesn't go too in depth in terms of the judging changes, but I think they are the most significant. I am on my work computer so I can't browse too much, so if someone finds a more informative article feel free to share!

 

[Ghost Bro]

Aggression over octagon control??

I assume that's what fight area means..

 

[member 3289]

This one might have more (or clearer) info

ABC body approves changes to MMA scoring criteria, new rules in landslide vote

 

[Andrewsimar Palhardass]

Aggression over octagon control??

I assume that's what fight area means..

Yeah, which I am okay with. I think too much stock is put into "octagon control".

There was discussion about including "damage", which was frowned upon from a political standpoint and I believe changed to "impact". I think that is an important criteria that should be weighed, but they have to take into consideration the fact that some guys show damage a lot more quickly than others. A fly could land on Conor's right eyebrow and it will start bleeding, whereas other guys are harder to cut. Also, we are dealing with fighters of different skin pigments so it is hard to see if a darker fighter is damaged vs a Caucasian fighter.

 

[Andrewsimar Palhardass]

This one might have more (or clearer) info

ABC body approves changes to MMA scoring criteria, new rules in landslide vote

My man. Thanks. Added to OP.

 

[Ghost Bro]

Yeah, which I am okay with. I think too much stock is put into "octagon control".

There was discussion about including "damage", which was frowned upon from a political standpoint and I believe changed to "impact". I think that is an important criteria that should be weighed, but they have to take into consideration the fact that some guys show damage a lot more quickly than others. A fly could land on Conor's right eyebrow and it will start bleeding, whereas other guys are harder to cut. Also, we are dealing with fighters of different skin pigments so it is hard to see if a darker fighter is damaged vs a Caucasian fighter.

Just seems like an equivalent but kind of backwards way of looking at things..someone not having octagon control is simply someone retreating..to someone who's advancing, scored as the aggressor. Does it mean that, if they landed equally someone might've scored a round for Hendricks instead of Wonderboy? Just for moving forrwad? Curious to how its implemented.
Both valid points at the end. I was actually thinking that Nate's scar probably hasn't healed from the last fight.

 

[Andrewsimar Palhardass]

Just seems like an equivalent but kind of backwards way of looking at things..someone not having octagon control is simply someone retreating..to someone who's advancing, scored as the aggressor. Does it mean that, if they landed equally someone might've scored a round for Hendricks instead of Wonderboy? Just for moving forrwad? Curious to how its implemented.
Both valid points at the end. I was actually thinking that Nate's scar probably hasn't healed from the last fight.

I think "octagon control" is the "moving forward" category. Moving forward is separate from aggressiveness. Also, they have made a point to say that by far the biggest criteria is effective striking and grappling. The control portion is only a last ditch effort if everything else is a tie.

 

[Ceiling Fan]

In case anyone needs a TLDR on the rule changes, I helped put one together for simplicity's sake with caps for emphasis and TLDRing the TLDR:

1) 12-6 elbows are still ILLEGAL
2) Heel kicks to the kidney (like from the bottom of full guard) are now LEGAL
3) Grabbing the clavicle is now LEGAL
4) Women now have to wear the same shorts as male fighters, and female tops now ONLY include a SPORTS BRA and/or a RASH GUARD. No more loose Reebok tank tops, Tshirts, singlets, grappling pants, or the like.
5) "Grounded fighter" is now redefined to eliminate the old expression of "playing the game" where a standing fighter leans down to put a finger on the canvas to avoid getting kneed or kicked in the head. To ground themselves, they must put BOTH palms/fists completely on the canvas. A knee or leg down is still considered grounded.
6) 10-8 rules have been loosened to allow for considerations of IMPACT (Damage), DOMINANCE, and DURATION. Put simply, more 10-8s should happen. However, when it comes to Dominance, staying in guard or holding position does NOT count. If a round has two of the three listed criteria, it could be a 10-8. 10-7s may also happen if all three are a factor for one fighter over another.
7) Aggression and subsequently "Cage/Octagon/Ring Control" are now ONLY tiebreakers when striking and grappling is even in a round.
8) Early weigh-in procedures utilized as seen in recent UFC events will be ADOPTED by the remaining states.
9) Walking towards your opponent with your fingers extended is now by itself ILLEGAL. Who knows how it'll be enforced. Hopefully it translates into something like the second eye poke resulting in an automatic point deduction, but we don't really know.

States can adopt these rules as they see fit, but NJ most likely will not.

 

[Ghost Bro]

I think "octagon control" is the "moving forward" category. Moving forward is separate from aggressiveness. Also, they have made a point to say that by far the biggest criteria is effective striking and grappling. The control portion is only a last ditch effort if everything else is a tie.

True dat, sounds like a decent change, next event should be interesting!

 

[Andrewsimar Palhardass]

True dat, sounds like a decent change, next event should be interesting!

Yeah, I think the judges have been kind of implementing it recently, because I have seen a few more wacky scores and 10-8 rounds. I just like that it makes things a bit more clear for the judges and it sets their priorities for them. We will always have garbage decisions, but I think this will help us to better separate the good judges from the bad ones.

 

[Wild]

In case anyone needs a TLDR on the rule changes, I helped put one together for simplicity's sake with caps for emphasis and TLDRing the TLDR:

1) 12-6 elbows are still ILLEGAL
2) Heel kicks to the kidney (like from the bottom of full guard) are now LEGAL
3) Grabbing the clavicle is now LEGAL
4) Women now have to wear the same shorts as male fighters, and female tops now ONLY include a SPORTS BRA and/or a RASH GUARD. No more loose Reebok tank tops, Tshirts, singlets, grappling pants, or the like.
5) "Grounded fighter" is now redefined to eliminate the old expression of "playing the game" where a standing fighter leans down to put a finger on the canvas to avoid getting kneed or kicked in the head. To ground themselves, they must put BOTH palms/fists completely on the canvas. A knee or leg down is still considered grounded.
6) 10-8 rules have been loosened to allow for considerations of IMPACT (Damage), DOMINANCE, and DURATION. Put simply, more 10-8s should happen. However, when it comes to Dominance, staying in guard or holding position does NOT count. If a round has two of the three listed criteria, it could be a 10-8. 10-7s may also happen if all three are a factor for one fighter over another.
7) Aggression and subsequently "Cage/Octagon/Ring Control" are now ONLY tiebreakers when striking and grappling is even in a round.
8) Early weigh-in procedures utilized as seen in recent UFC events will be ADOPTED by the remaining states.

States can adopt these rules as they see fit, but NJ most likely will not.

A lot of good stuff here. Would like to see 12-6 elbows get reinstated, and something done about open fingers (eye pokes).

 

[Andrewsimar Palhardass]

A lot of good stuff here. Would like to see 12-6 elbows get reinstated, and something done about open fingers (eye pokes).

They did do something about the eye pokes. They can now take a point away for repeatedly reaching out with extended fingers. Before, they had to wait for a poke to actually take the point away. It has to be either a closed fist or vertical fingers.

 

[Wild]

They did do something about the eye pokes. They can now take a point away for repeatedly reaching out with extended fingers. Before, they had to wait for a poke to actually take the point away. It has to be either a closed fist or vertical fingers.

Oh I like that.

 

[La Paix]

3) Grabbing the clavicle is now LEGAL

I didn't realize this was illegal in the first place. Can someone give an example of this being used in the past and why it allowed?

 

[aghof]

did they consider eliminating 12-6 elbows? If so, I wonder who would have argued against it...

 

[Ceiling Fan]

Oh yeah, the fingers extended is a foul too now. Still don't know exactly how it'll be enforced. I would prefer something like first fouls are warnings, second fouls are automatic point deduction. After all, the damage has been done regardless of intent.

 

[Ceiling Fan]

A lot of good stuff here. Would like to see 12-6 elbows get reinstated, and something done about open fingers (eye pokes).

I'd be up for 12-6 elbows getting legalized as well. And I added the ninth point raised today.

 

[Wild]

I'd be up for 12-6 elbows getting legalized as well. And I added the ninth point raised today.

I'm pretty surprised 12-6 elbows didn't get overturned. How can you elbow someone in a 12-6 motion from the bottom, but be penalized for the same motion from the top? It makes no sense.

 

[Ceiling Fan]

Although, one problem codifying fouls as the first is always a warning and the second an automatic deduction would theoretically allow for Cheick Kongo type incidents. You know, when he seemed to have a string of fights where he kicked every opponent in the groin. It may not have been all of them, but it certainly felt like it.

 

[Ceiling Fan]

I'm pretty surprised 12-6 elbows didn't get overturned. How can you elbow someone in a 12-6 motion from the bottom, but be penalized for the same motion from the top? It makes no sense.

To paraphrase Big John, the clock stays the same from any angle, it doesn't change depending on your own angle. It's relative to the cage itself. They don't want *insert elbow drop gif from rassling here*.

 

[aghof]

To paraphrase Big John, the clock stays the same from any angle, it doesn't change depending on your own angle. It's relative to the cage itself. They don't want *insert elbow drop gif from rassling here*.

 

[Ceiling Fan]

Rogan may be on to something when they're afraid 12-6 elbows after seeing things like this. Even though standing elbows with your shoulder behind it can do that kind of damage too.

 

[Ceiling Fan]

Right, it could be something like a Showtime Elbow. Jump off the cage into a flying downward elbow.

 

[Limpy]

I didn't realize this was illegal in the first place. Can someone give an example of this being used in the past and why it allowed?

I don't even know what a clavicle is.