Why do you think Brazil fell so hard from #1 in MMA?

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Ted Williams' head

Ted Williams' head

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From the start of the UFC onwards it was always about Brazil. Pride era you had BTT and Chute Boxe as the most dominant camps. Moving into the modern era Anderson Silva and Jose Aldo were both p4p kings and unbeatable champs. Brazil always produced both submission sharks and muay thai killers in such a large quantity they would be the top champs and contenders in every org. Then Anderson, Aldo, Barao all violently dethroned and now the only Brazilian UFC champs are female. Now Brazilians are moving to the States to improve their skills.

It's at the point now where I associate Brazilian prospects as talented but technically flawed who are destined for perpetual mid-card status. Maybe that's just me. Seeing Thomas Almeida struggle recently kind of enforced it for me.

Did Americans just take their shit and make it better?
 
Sheepdog

Sheepdog

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When you realize that Hrraazeel sucks at boxing, sucks at wrestling and isn't anything to write home about in the other striking arts either, then it makes sense.
 
regular john

regular john

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Brazilians had a headstart on everybody else and first hand BJJ training at a time when not everybody had it and they carried it into a few waves of success due to experience and sheer toughness. Now brazilian fight camps are among the worst in all of mma as there is no one knowledgeable teaching wrestling or striking to the youngers and they don't seem to understand the concept of gameplanning. brazilian fighters are actually some of the most helpless, most handicapped bunch nowadays. once WMMA develops a reasonable talent pool then brazilian lady fighters will fell too.

so yes, americans took that shit and made it better. Also Brazil never had any "muay thai killers". muay thai is non-existent in Brazil. The Chute Boxe fighting style was just kind of an even more aggressive, mindless braindead brand of dutch kickboxing.
 
Ted Williams' head

Ted Williams' head

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regular john said:
Brazilians had a headstart on everybody else and first hand BJJ training at a time when not everybody had it and they carried it into a few waves of success due to experience and sheer toughness. Now brazilian fight camps are among the worst in all of mma as there is no one knowledgeable teaching wrestling or striking to the youngers and they don't seem to understand the concept of gameplanning. brazilian fighters are actually some of the most helpless, most handicapped bunch nowadays. once WMMA develops a reasonable talent pool then brazilian lady fighters will fell too.

so yes, americans took that shit and made it better. Also Brazil never had any "muay thai killers". muay thai is non-existent in Brazil. The Chute Boxe fighting style was just kind of an even more aggressive, mindless braindead brand of dutch kickboxing.
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This proves forever that wrestling is the greatest base, no if ands or buts about it
 
Ted Williams' head

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Maybe it has less to do with Brazil and more to do with wrestling is the greatest

Stipe Miocic WRESTLING BASE
Jon Jones & DC WRESTLING BASE
Tyron Woodley WRESTLING BASE
Tony Ferg WRESTLING BASE
Dillasnake WRESTLING BASE
DJ WRESTLING BASE
 
jason73

jason73

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Cuz steroids are illegal now and the stubborn belief that bjj is all you need to win fights.plus every brazilian who makes enough money moves to florida .not good for building future stars
 
Rambo John J

Rambo John J

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I think they were #1 and others have caught up

some were using but mostly gap has narrowed and most of best training is now in USA or Europe
 
HEATH VON DOOM

HEATH VON DOOM

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Oct 21, 2015
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jason73 said:
Cuz steroids are illegal now and the stubborn belief that bjj is all you need to win fights.plus every brazilian who makes enough money moves to florida .not good for building future stars
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I will give you steroids but Aldo was shit off his back and kept his fights standing as much as possible.
 
La Paix

La Paix

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Amateur Shit Stirrer said:
Maybe it has less to do with Brazil and more to do with wrestling is the greatest

Stipe Miocic WRESTLING BASE
Jon Jones & DC WRESTLING BASE
Tyron Woodley WRESTLING BASE
Tony Ferg WRESTLING BASE
Dillasnake WRESTLING BASE
DJ WRESTLING BASE
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Tony has a wrestling base? I thought he was Eddies black belt golden child?
 
Gay For Longo

Gay For Longo

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Amateur Shit Stirrer said:
"Ferguson was a three-sport athlete at Muskegon Catholic Central High School in football, baseball and wrestling. He was the starting defensive back for the 2002 state football champions and was a three-time All-State selection in wrestling, winning the 152 lbs division in 2002."

Wikipedia ftw!
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Huh
Maybe football and baseball are the best base
Stipe played baseball too
Might be on to something here
 
Gay For Longo

Gay For Longo

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regular john said:
Also Aldo who used to play soccer and that's why he has some of the best muay thai leg kicks in the history of striking :eek::eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:
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If we move over to boxing, the current #1 (maybe #2) p4p boxer in the world takes his footwork (some of the best footwork of all time) from being trained in Russian dance
 
regular john

regular john

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Gay for Longo said:
If we move over to boxing, the current #1 (maybe #2) p4p boxer in the world takes his footwork (some of the best footwork of all time) from being trained in Russian dance
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if we're talking music then salsa is the undisputed #1 best base for combat sports.
 
Hwoarang

Hwoarang

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Amateur Shit Stirrer said:
This proves forever that wrestling is the greatest base, no if ands or buts about it
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List of champs and their "base";
Stipe- striking
Cormier- wrestling
Whitaker- striking
Woodley - wrestling but he got the bullshit nod over wonderboy (striking)
Connor - striking
Max - striking
TJ - wrestling
Dj- fukin everything?
Cyborg - striking
Nunes- striking
Rose/jj- striking

A few ifs and buts there. Striking base seems more common. What's clear is bjj as a base seems to have fallen off...until RDA or Werdum can get a belt back they have no representation.
 
Nemo?

Nemo?

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Yep Usada did a number on the Brazilians....

BUT

The real reason is the rules they fight under now... Take away elbows on the ground and IMO it equalizes wrestling and BJJ. If wrestlers had to create space to strike so they could keep it on the ground it would be more exciting than the lay and pray game we are drowning in today.

Also allow knee’s to a “grounded opponent “.
 
La Paix

La Paix

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Nemo? said:
Yep Usada did a number on the Brazilians....

BUT

The real reason is the rules they fight under now... Take away elbows on the ground and IMO it equalizes wrestling and BJJ. If wrestlers had to create space to strike so they could keep it on the ground it would be more exciting than the lay and pray game we are drowning in today.

Also allow knee’s to a “grounded opponent “.
Click to expand...
Excellent point here. Same with the cage making it much easier to wall n stall just grinding dudes for minutes compared to the traditional ring.
 
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