Society The Donald J. Trump Show - 4 more years editions

[Qat]

You're asking hypotheticals. I gave you a video where Trump said he won't let Putin annex land on his watch while maintaining both countries should advance relations. Putin has suggested he wants the same. But the media will keep trying to spin their words.

Oh please, do you really buy that? Its the typical Trump-thing saying "I will do it all better, because me", but never saying how exactly.
Those two goals actually oppose themselves kinda..

Space exploration would be great, yeah. I wish Europe would do more in that regard as well.
I read more or less bad things about Musk/Tesla in the last couple days though.

 

[Qat]

All we talk about now our racial and religious divides. It's depressing.

I admire you confidence, but Trump is dividing a lot?! I mean, like really.. How do you suspect that to go away?

 

[IschKabibble]

I admire you confidence, but Trump is dividing a lot?! I mean, like really.. How do you suspect that to go away?

I support Trump because he's waving a giant middle finger to our establishment unlike any politician before. It's the shit I admired about Bernie x1000.

You're going to have to let things play out a bit more. You're clearly not getting the point that he's making sensational headlines for free publicity. And he's letting the left talk themselves in circles and trip themselves up on their own analysis. It's hilarious.

 

[Zeph]

You're asking hypotheticals. I gave you a video where Trump said he won't let Putin annex land on his watch while maintaining both countries should advance relations. Putin has suggested he wants the same. But the media will keep trying to spin their words.

.

Trump said two contradictory statements, three if you consider improving relations with Putin while also stopping him from annexing areas of other countries to be mutually exclusive, concerning the annexation of Crimea. First he said it wouldn't happen under his watch, and then he said well you have to take into account what the people in that area want, and he has heard they want to be part of Russia - which some do. Yet, both of those statements can't be true, either he takes into consideration of what the people want and allows the annexation, or he won't allow it.

 

[Qat]

I support Trump because he's waving a giant middle finger to our establishment unlike any politician before. It's the shit I admired about Bernie x1000.

You're going to have to let things play out a bit more. You're clearly not getting the point that he's making sensational headlines for free publicity. And he's letting the left talk themselves in circles and trip themselves up on their own analysis. It's hilarious.

Yeah, he is not just showing it to the establishment though. I'm kinda sure the wife of this Khan-dude is not part of that, like a lot of people he is alienating.
Which is exactly creating a divide.

You are not targeted so you don't care I guess.

Even if all of that is a big masterplan, there is collateral damage.

 

[IschKabibble]

Yeah, he is not just showing it to the establishment though. I'm kinda sure the wife of this Khan-dude is not part of that, like a lot of people he is alienating.
Which is exactly creating a divide.

Correct. I did state a few pages back I thought that was really dumb. But he's a counter-puncher. The retort was to be expected. As was the left's inevitable meltdown over it.

You are not targeted so you don't care I guess.

lol

 

[IschKabibble]

I gotta get to work. My shitpost shift was muddled with too much argumentation. @Left Hook Larry, I'm gonna need you to cover from here broham.

 

[IschKabibble]

I admire you confidence, but Trump is dividing a lot?! I mean, like really.. How do you suspect that to go away?

One follow-up question before I leave:

How were race relations in America before Trump announced his candidacy? Is Trump the cause of our race divide? Or is he the one who calls a spade a spade?

 

[Qat]

One follow-up question before I leave:

How were race relations in America before Trump announced his candidacy? Is Trump the cause of our race divide? Or is he the one who calls a spade a spade?

I really can't answer that question well since I don't dive into that realm a lot. I am just calling a spade a spade here.

 

[IschKabibble]

 

[Pitbull9]

Trumps done. He fucked up bad with this Khan thing. Now Hilary is up 10 points. He better fucking get it together. The debates are going to be the final story imo

 

[DFW4L]

NATO is said to be obsolete because it doesn't help combat the guerilla warfare we're enduring today.

that is by definition not what NATO does

 

[IschKabibble]

that is by definition not what NATO does

Turkey calls for rare NATO talks after attacks along Syrian border

NATO said Sunday that it would meet this week after Turkey called for special talks amid heightened concerns over its security.

Turkey made the request under Article 4 of NATO's founding treaty, which allows countries to ask for consultations when they believe their territorial integrity, political independence or security is threatened.

It's only the fifth time in NATO history that members will meet under Article 4, NATO spokeswoman Oana Lungescu told CNN.

"In the wake of increased security threats following the attacks against our security and law-enforcement forces in provinces of Diyarbakır, Şanlıurfa and Kilis, in particular the terrorist attack that took the lives of 32 innocent Turkish citizens in Suruç on 20 July 2015, all necessary measures are being taken and in this context, operations are also being carried out by the Turkish Armed Forces," the Turkish Foreign Ministry said in a statement.

Turkey calls for rare NATO talks - CNN.com

 

[IschKabibble]

Per NATO's website:

Article 4
The Parties will consult together whenever, in the opinion of any of them, the territorial integrity, political independence or security of any of the Parties is threatened.

Article 5
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .

 

[IschKabibble]

 

[DFW4L]

Turkey calls for rare NATO talks after attacks along Syrian border

NATO said Sunday that it would meet this week after Turkey called for special talks amid heightened concerns over its security.

Turkey made the request under Article 4 of NATO's founding treaty, which allows countries to ask for consultations when they believe their territorial integrity, political independence or security is threatened.

It's only the fifth time in NATO history that members will meet under Article 4, NATO spokeswoman Oana Lungescu told CNN.

"In the wake of increased security threats following the attacks against our security and law-enforcement forces in provinces of Diyarbakır, Şanlıurfa and Kilis, in particular the terrorist attack that took the lives of 32 innocent Turkish citizens in Suruç on 20 July 2015, all necessary measures are being taken and in this context, operations are also being carried out by the Turkish Armed Forces," the Turkish Foreign Ministry said in a statement.

Turkey calls for rare NATO talks - CNN.com

Turkey trying to use its 'NATO card' every time it has an issue with anyone (state or non-state agressors - or imaginary aggressors) is par for the course with Milk shitter Erdogan, that has nothing to do with NATO's charter, what it does, etc...

Turkey is trying to NATO flex on a domestic issue in that article, 'talks?', 'consultations', lol....

 

[DFW4L]

Per NATO's website:

Article 4
The Parties will consult together whenever, in the opinion of any of them, the territorial integrity, political independence or security of any of the Parties is threatened.

Article 5
The Parties agree that an armed attack against one or more of them in Europe or North America shall be considered an attack against them all and consequently they agree that, if such an armed attack occurs, each of them, in exercise of the right of individual or collective self-defence recognised by Article 51 of the Charter of the United Nations, will assist the Party or Parties so attacked by taking forthwith, individually and in concert with the other Parties, such action as it deems necessary, including the use of armed force, to restore and maintain the security of the North Atlantic area.

Any such armed attack and all measures taken as a result thereof shall immediately be reported to the Security Council. Such measures shall be terminated when the Security Council has taken the measures necessary to restore and maintain international peace and security .

none of that says 'we got your back on interior domestic terrorism issues Erdogan bro'

 

[IschKabibble]

Turkey trying to use its 'NATO card' every time it has an issue with anyone (state or non-state agressors - or imaginary aggressors) is par for the course with Milk shitter Erdogan, that has nothing to do with NATO's charter, what it does, etc...

Turkey is trying to NATO flex on a domestic issue in that article, 'talks?', 'consultations', lol....

Just using that as an example. Does article 4 and 5 not sound like it could apply to terrorism?

 

[IschKabibble]

I'm not saying specific to Turkey. How about the Bataclan, Pulse and Nice attacks? Can we not invoke Article 4 ourselves?

 

[DFW4L]

Just using that as an example. Does article 4 and 5 not sound like it could apply to terrorism?

No.

NATO's charter has to be read in the context of when/why/how NATO was created, if you dismiss all of that entirely and just read the words with zero context I suppose someone could say the NATO countries are supposed to help each other fight domestic terrorism by non nation states...

Norway didn't call for NATO backup when that dude shot up those kids

 

[IschKabibble]

No.

NATO's charter has to be read in the context of when/why/how NATO was created, if you dismiss all of that entirely and just read the words with zero context I suppose someone could say the NATO countries are supposed to help each other fight domestic terrorism by non nation states...

Norway didn't call for NATO backup when that dude shot up those kids

Again, per NATO's website:

Terrorism poses a direct threat to the security of the citizens of NATO countries, and to international stability and prosperity. It is a persistent global threat that knows no border, nationality or religion and is a challenge that the international community must tackle together. NATO’s work on counter-terrorism focuses on improving awareness of the threat, developing capabilities to prepare and respond, and enhancing engagement with partner countries and other international actors.

How much longer can we turn a blind eye?

 

[IschKabibble]

Norway didn't call for NATO backup when that dude shot up those kids

To be fair, he was native.

 

[DFW4L]

How much longer can we turn a blind eye?

who is turning a blind eye to what?

(not being a smartass, genuinely don't know what you are suggesting NATO is failing at)

Article 4 is about 'consultations and discussions', preventive diplomacy and such...

'come talk to me bros, bad guys are making trouble in our country'

-Erdogan

 

[Splinty]

Turkey trying to use its 'NATO card' every time it has an issue with anyone (state or non-state agressors - or imaginary aggressors) is par for the course with Milk shitter Erdogan, that has nothing to do with NATO's charter, what it does, etc...

Turkey is trying to NATO flex on a domestic issue in that article, 'talks?', 'consultations', lol....

I don't disagree with anything happening in here.

Erdogan is constantly manipulating.

NATO does not have a clear redirection for terrorism. Its in some half ass ways being shoehorned onto existing NATO missions. There isn't a good cohesive plan for nebulous non-nation states as a whole.

But, this call by Turkey is easily under the NATO umbrella of protecting sovereign territory integrity.

ISIS has a want for removal of modern borders near the 'caliphate' both by physical means and mind share. This is a bit different than al quaeda bros bombing and running. ISIS looks to take over geography.

 

[DFW4L]

But, this call by Turkey is easily under the NATO umbrella of protecting sovereign territory integrity.

ISIS has a want for removal of modern borders near the 'caliphate' both by physical means and mind share. This is a bit different than al quaeda bros bombing and running. ISIS looks to take over geography.

I think we agree 90% on the topic, but on this part the conversation starts here, imo...

isn't ISIS just an international criminal organization?