General Jordan > Lebron

[1031]

First off-

A (young) Lebron fan might try to counter, "well if Jordan is better than Lebron b/c he has more championships, then Bill Russell is better than Jordan".

Flawed logic. These same people will not try to act like Robert Horry is greater, because his 7 championship rings.

Regarding Bill Russell's 11 championships, Did You Know-

How many readers are aware of how many seasons Bill Russell averaged 20 or more points per game for a season?

ZERO



Bill Russell's first championship Bill had two teammates average 20 or more points per game(Bob Cousey/Bill Sharmen)

Bill's regular season ppg 14.7 dropped in the playoffs to 13.9ppg.





Bill Russell's 2nd championship had two of Bill's teammates join him as NBA All Stars. Bill's 2nd championship Bill was not the leading scorer of his team. He was not the 2nd leading scorer. Bill was not even the 3rd highest scorer on the team. On a team of five starters, Bill Russell had the 4th highest ppg.



Bill Russell's 3rd championship he was the 4th highest scoring starter on his team



Bill's 4th championship he was the 3rd highest scorer



Bill's 5th championship he was barely the 2nd highest scorer, however his #'s increased in the playoffs(unlike previous years) and this championship has a solid argument for Bill being the mvp of the team/series.



Bill's 6th championship he was the 3rd highest scorer



Bill's 7th championship he was the 4th highest scorer



Bill's 8th championship he was 3rd highest scorer



Bill's 9th championship he was 4th highest scorer, narrowly beating out the 5th leading scorer(12.6) by averaging 12.9ppg.



Bill's 10th championship he was 4th highest scorer, beating out the 5th leading scorer(12.2) by averaging 12.5ppg



Bill's 11th championship Bill was 7th leading scorer. There are 5 starters, Bill managed to have four teammate starters, as well as two bench players average more points than Bill did, with less minutes played.

You have successfully argued Bill Russell is clearly the greatest basketball player to have ever played in the NBA because of his demonstrated ability to make his teammates great as a team.

And obviously Michael was better than Lebron is.
Fuck next you people will bicker over whether Sofia Loren was more shaggable than Kim Kardashian.

 

[Truck Party]

First part of your post I like, you make some good bring ups like regarding the 3point shots being mroe efficient than mid range jumpers.

However your statement of when James lst in the finals it's rarely been due to his performance, I'll say I disagree with that more than I agree with the former.

You need to understand we're talking about a team's #1 player in important games. You can't score less than 20 points and be having 6-8 turnovers a game.

ok, so what've been LeBron's stat's in finals he's lost?

 

[D241]

ok, so what've been LeBron's stat's in finals he's lost?

when James has lost in the finals it's rarely been due to his performance.

2018 -7 rebounds 8 assist 23 points, not bad, but not great. Factor in he had 6 turnovers, it's not going to be good enough to win in the finals.

2016- 12 reb 9 assist 23 points with 5 turnovers, 8 reb 9 assist 19points 7 Turnovers, 13 reb 9 assist 25points 7 Turnovers

2015-12reb, 8assist 20points 2 turnovers

2014-6 reb 3 assist 25pts 4 turnovers, 5 reb 7 assist 22pts 7 turnovers

2013-11reb 5assist 15pts 2 turnovers

2011-8 reb 4assist 20pts 5 Turnovers, 9reb 7assist 8pts 4 Turnovers, 10reb 10assist 17pts 4 Turnovers, 4reb 6assist 21pts 6 Turnovers


We're talking about a team's #1 player in the finals. Surely Lebron's team's chances would have been better with better productivity than the above stats.

 

[Truck Party]

2018 -7 rebounds 8 assist 23 points, not bad, but not great. Factor in he had 6 turnovers, it's not going to be good enough to win in the finals.

2016- 12 reb 9 assist 23 points with 5 turnovers, 8 reb 9 assist 19points 7 Turnovers, 13 reb 9 assist 25points 7 Turnovers

2015-12reb, 8assist 20points 2 turnovers

2014-6 reb 3 assist 25pts 4 turnovers, 5 reb 7 assist 22pts 7 turnovers

2013-11reb 5assist 15pts 2 turnovers

2011-8 reb 4assist 20pts 5 Turnovers, 9reb 7assist 8pts 4 Turnovers, 10reb 10assist 17pts 4 Turnovers, 4reb 6assist 21pts 6 Turnovers


We're talking about a team's #1 player in the finals. Surely Lebron's team's chances would have been better with better productivity than the above stats.

what stats are you looking at?

here's what he averaged in the 2015 finals, doesn't seem to jive with what you posted

 

[D241]

what stats are you looking at?

here's what he averaged in the 2015 finals, doesn't seem to jive with what you posted

First off, even if that one year was inaccurate(which it is), have I not disproved your statement of when James loses in the finals it's rarely due to his performance? You're talking about a averages, but averages do not win championships, winning games do, and on June 11th, 2015, Lebron "King" James put up 12 rebounds 8 assist 20 points and 2 turnovers in an NBA Finals game in which he lost.

Golden State Warriors at Cleveland Cavaliers Box Score, June 11, 2015 | Basketball-Reference.com
2015 game 4 finals - Google Search


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5MRavLgH_c

 

[D241]

Now, I'm going to take a break to play as the Cleveland Cavs against Dominick and Spud's Hawks. I'm going for a triple double.

 

[member 603]

The GOAT.....

Never felt that much awe and anger looking at all his championship banners in the UC rafters

 

[D241]

Why anger?

 

[Truck Party]

First off, even if that one year was inaccurate(which it is), have I not disproved your statement of when James loses in the finals it's rarely due to his performance? You're talking about a averages, but averages do not win championships, winning games do, and on June 11th, 2015, Lebron "King" James put up 12 rebounds 8 assist 20 points and 2 turnovers in an NBA Finals game in which he lost.

Golden State Warriors at Cleveland Cavaliers Box Score, June 11, 2015 | Basketball-Reference.com
2015 game 4 finals - Google Search


View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f5MRavLgH_c

I was referring to Lebron's teams losing finals series, if you simply want to take one performance in one game in each of the finals & expect that to prove something, well that's interesting

 

[D241]

I was referring to Lebron's teams losing finals series, if you simply want to take one performance in one game in each of the finals & expect that to prove something, well that's interesting

On no planet does a team's clear best player under produce, his team loses, and no one says his (sub par) performance effected the outcome.

You want to say he only had a handful of bad games, that's fine.
You want to say he's still a great player despite some bad performances, that's fine.

But when he has bad games and his team loses, those two come hand in hand. You should be able to see this but I feel you're in so much debate mode you're unable to understand simple logic.

 

[Truck Party]

On no planet does a team's clear best player under produce, his team loses, and no one says his (sub par) performance effected the outcome.

You want to say he only had a handful of bad games, that's fine.
You want to say he's still a great player despite some bad performances, that's fine.

But when he has bad games and his team loses, those two come hand in hand. You should be able to see this but I feel you're in so much debate mode you're unable to understand simple logic.

I can't understand logic? I'm not the guy arguing that a 1 game sample size is a better indicator of how a player performed in a series over the average of a 4-7 game sample size.

 

[D241]

I can't understand logic? I'm not the guy arguing that a 1 game sample size is a better indicator of how a player performed in a series over the average of a 4-7 game sample size.

Well, now you're the guy who was given TWELVE game samples but you're only seeing one. Keep changing the goal post but you made a statement that Lebron having poor performances hasn't cost his teams games lost in the finals, yet I provided you NOT ONE, NOT TWO, NOT THREE, BUT TWELVE individual finals game stats of games they lost and Lebron didn't perform up to standard.

It's crazy how much you're trying to hang onto a statement that's been disproven with TWELVE examples, not one.

 

[D241]

I can't understand logic? I'm not the guy arguing that a 1 game sample size is a better indicator of how a player performed in a series over the average of a 4-7 game sample size.

To clarify this is what I mean by changing the goal post. Your statement I disputed was that Lebron having a bad performance didn't effect his team in any finals. I provided you twelve games where he performed bad and his team lost that game, as well as series.

Now you're acting like I'm arguing that one game's stats is indicative to that of an entire series, which was NEVER even the argument, yet one you're trying to argue because that'd be easier to argue than somehow trying to tell me that 11reb 5assist 15pts 2 turnovers wasn't a reason the team lost, or 9reb 7assist 8pts 4 Turnovers, 10reb 10assist 17pts 4 Turnovers, or 4reb 6assist 21pts 6 Turnovers weren't any effect on his teams not winning in those games.

 

[D241]

Only going off memory, there was a game against Utah Jazz, in the finals, where Jordan played very poorly that game, and they lost. Those two are connected.

Yet the twelve examples I give of Lebron playing poorly, or not up to standard, you refuse to acknowledge that his bad games maybe could have had an effect on the outcome.

 

[Truck Party]

Well, now you're the guy who was given TWELVE game samples but you're only seeing one. Keep changing the goal post but you made a statement that Lebron having poor performances hasn't cost his teams games lost in the finals, yet I provided you NOT ONE, NOT TWO, NOT THREE, BUT TWELVE individual finals game stats of games they lost and Lebron didn't perform up to standard.

It's crazy how much you're trying to hang onto a statement that's been disproven with TWELVE examples, not one.

To clarify this is what I mean by changing the goal post. Your statement I disputed was that Lebron having a bad performance didn't effect his team in any finals. I provided you twelve games where he performed bad and his team lost that game, as well as series.

Now you're acting like I'm arguing that one game's stats is indicative to that of an entire series, which was NEVER even the argument, yet one you're trying to argue because that'd be easier to argue than somehow trying to tell me that 11reb 5assist 15pts 2 turnovers wasn't a reason the team lost, or 9reb 7assist 8pts 4 Turnovers, 10reb 10assist 17pts 4 Turnovers, or 4reb 6assist 21pts 6 Turnovers weren't any effect on his teams not winning in those games.

I didn't say any, I said rarely. Specifically I said when they've lost the finals it's rarely been due to his performance. For starters, not all of the games you pointed to were bad performances, you listed one where he was one assist away from a triple double b/c he had 5 turnovers & one where he was 2 assists shy of a triple double with 2 turnovers. Many others he was close to a triple doubles, we have different definitions of bad games. He ended up with a great average stat line in most of the rest of those series, so he must've been balling out the other games, & that's ignoring the advanced stats which give a far more accurate picture of what happened in any series or game. Secondly, there's been one finals series he was supposed to win, yet didn't. That was Dallas. This should help

You're listing a game where he had literal triple double now as a bad games, & you're telling me I'm taking the easy way out of an argument? Only on themmacommunity dot com can I read such high quality hot takes

 

[jason73]

 

[Truck Party]

that is the funniest tweet I've ever read

 

[D241]

I didn't say any, I said rarely. Specifically I said when they've lost the finals it's rarely been due to his performance. For starters, not all of the games you pointed to were bad performances, you listed one where he was one assist away from a triple double b/c he had 5 turnovers & one where he was 2 assists shy of a triple double with 2 turnovers. Many others he was close to a triple doubles, we have different definitions of bad games. He ended up with a great average stat line in most of the rest of those series, so he must've been balling out the other games, & that's ignoring the advanced stats which give a far more accurate picture of what happened in any series or game. Secondly, there's been one finals series he was supposed to win, yet didn't. That was Dallas. This should help

You're listing a game where he had literal triple double now as a bad games, & you're telling me I'm taking the easy way out of an argument? Only on themmacommunity dot com can I read such high quality hot takes

Good post and you'll probably accuse me of nitpicking and you might be right, but rarely seems to be where the crux of our argument is.

I read your post as if you're saying rarely when Lebron has a poor performance did it affect the outcome of the game or series.

What I think it should read, is, "it's rare Lebron James has a poor performance in the finals". That'd be a lot more accurate and a statement I wouldn't debate. BUT, in the twelve examples when Lebron did have a rare bad game, it's not rare that he lost those games, it's common. What's rare is having bad games, but losing games in which he played bad is not rare, it's very common.

 

[D241]

 

[Hauler]

I'm thoroughly enjoying the clusterfuck of a season that the Lakers are having.

Lebron is a diva. A flopper. And a shitty leader.

Jordan was a beast.

 

[Hauler]

The Lakers finished last season with a .427 winning percentage
They added "the greatest player of all time" and 66 games into the season they have a .455 winning percentage.

Lebron has the talent to be the best ever, but he doesn't have Jordan's desire. Not even close.

 

[Hauler]

Jordan missed most of his 2nd season with a broken foot, so Lebron had a head start on him in minutes logged.
For the sake of fairness, I've omitted the season Jordan skipped to play baseball and his 3 season retirement. I did include the 1994 season where Jordan returned at the end of the season to play 17 games - that's the anomaly you see after the 9th season for Jordan.

Lebron logged more minutes but Jordan still scored more points.

Jordan led the league in scoring 10 times. James led the league once.

 

[D241]

MJ vs LBJ (first 15 seasons)

• Games Played in Reg. Seasons
MJ: 1072
LBJ: 1143

• MVPs
MJ: 5
LBJ: 4

• MVP Award Shares
MJ: 8.138 (all-time record)
LBJ: 8.066

• Championships
MJ: 6 in 6 appearances (100%)
LBJ: 3 in 9 appearances (33.3%)

• Finals MVPs
MJ: 6
LBJ: 3

• MVP and Finals MVP in the same season
MJ: 4 (1991, 1992, 1996, 1998)
LBJ: 2 (2012, 2013)

• Back-to-back Season MVP and Finals MVP on the same year
MJ: Yes (1992)
LBJ: Yes (2013)

• Scoring Titles
MJ: 10 (11x league leader, all-time record)
LBJ: 1

• Consecutive Scoring Titles
MJ: 7 (all-time record)
LBJ: 0

• Steals Titles
MJ: 3
LBJ: 0

• Rookie of the Year
MJ: 1
LBJ: 1

• Defensive Player of the Year
MJ: 1 - top 10 in voting 10 times (1987-93, 1996-98); top 5 seven times.
LBJ: 0 - top 10 in voting 6 times; top 5 three times.

• Offensive Rating (the higher, the better)
MJ: 117.97
LBJ: 116.32

• Defensive Rating (the lower, the better)
MJ: 102.83
LBJ: 103.25

• 3-Peat
MJ: 2
LBJ: 0

• First Championship
MJ: 7th Season
LBJ: 9th Season (after joining and forming a superteam)

• All-Star MVP
MJ: 3
LBJ: 2

• Slam Dunk Champion
MJ: 2 (top 1-3 all-time greatest dunker)
LBJ: 0

• All NBA 1st Team:
MJ: 10
LBJ: 12

• All NBA Defensive 1st Team:
MJ: 9
LBJ: 5

• MVP, Scoring Title, Defensive Player of the Year in a Season
MJ: 1 (1988)
LBJ: 0

• Scoring Title and MVP in a season
MJ: 5 (1988, 1991, 1992, 1996, 1998)
LBJ: 0

• Scoring Title and Finals MVP in a season
MJ: 6 (1991-93, 1996-98; all-time record)
LBJ: 0

• Scoring Title, MVP and Finals MVP in a season
MJ: 4 (1991, 1992, 1996, 1998)
LBJ: 0

• Scoring Title and All NBA Defensive 1st Team in a season
MJ: 9 (1988-93, 1996-98)
LBJ: 0

• Scoring Title, Steals Title in a season
MJ: 3 (1988, 1990, 1993)
LBJ: 0

• Won a scoring title averaging a minimum of 8 assists and 7 reb. per game in a season
MJ: Yes (one of only 2 players in NBA history)
LBJ: No

• Career Points Per Game
MJ: 30.1 (all-time record)
LBJ: 27.2

• Career Playoffs Points Per Game
MJ: 33.4 (all-time record)
LBJ: 28.9

• Career NBA Finals PPG
MJ: 33.6
LBJ: 28.2

• Player Efficiency Rating
MJ: 27.91 (all-time record)
LBJ: 27.7

• Rookie Year Averages
MJ: 28.2 PPG, 6.5 RPG, 5.9 APG, 2.4 SPG, 0.8 BPG, 51.5% FGP
LBJ: 20.9 PPG, 5.5 RPG, 5.9 APG, 1.6 SPG, 0.7 BPG, 41.7% FGP

• Career Season FG%, 3PT%, FT%
MJ: 49.7% FG, 32.7% 3PT, 83.5% FT
LBJ: 50.4% FG, 34.4% 3PT, 73.9% FT

• Career Playoffs FG%, 3PT%, FT%
MJ: 48.7% FG, 33.2% 3PT, 82.8% FT
LBJ: 49.1% FG, 33.2% 3PT, 74.3% FT

• Career Finals FG%, 3PT%, FT%
MJ: 48.08% FG, 36.84% 3PT, 80.63% FT
LBJ: 47.2% FG, 34.3% 3PT, 73.9% FT

• 40 pt. Games in Reg. Seasons
MJ: 173 (2nd all-time)
LBJ: 49

• 40 pt. games in playoffs
MJ: 38
LBJ: 26

• 40 pt. games in finals
MJ: 6
LBJ: 7

• 50 pt. Games in Reg. Seasons
MJ: 31 (2nd all-time)
LBJ: 8

• 50 pt. games in playoffs
MJ: 8
LBJ: 1

• 50 pt. Games in finals
MJ: 1
LBJ: 1

• 60 pt. Games in Reg. Seasons
MJ: 4 (3rd all-time)
LBJ: 1

• 60 Pt. Games in Playoffs
MJ: 1
LBJ: 0

• Most Pts. In a game
MJ: 69
LBJ: 61

• Most Pts. In a Season
MJ: 3041 (1986-87)
LBJ: 2478 (2005-06)

• Most 3-Pt. Shots Made in a Game
MJ: 7
LBJ: 8

• Most Assists In a Game
MJ: 17
LBJ: 19

• Most Assists In a Season
MJ: 650 (1988-89)
LBJ: 747 (2017-18)

• Most Rebounds In a Game
MJ: 19 (Playoffs - May 14, 1991)
LBJ: 19 (Double OT)

• Most Rebounds In a Season
MJ: 652 (1988-89)
LBJ: 709 (2017-18)

• Most Steals In a Game
MJ: 10
LBJ: 7

• Most Steals In a Season
MJ: 259 (1987-88)
LBJ: 177 (2004-05)

• Most Blocks In a Game
MJ: 6
LBJ: 5

• Most Blocks In a Season
MJ: 131 (1987-88)
LBJ: 93 (2008-09)

• Most Turnovers In a Game
MJ: 9
LBJ: 10

• Most Turnovers In a Season
MJ: 291 (1984-85)
LBJ: 347 (2017-18)

• Career Turnovers
MJ: 2924 (2.7 TOPG)
LBJ: 3699 (3.5 TOPG), 3067 TOs already after 12th season

• Lead the team in Scoring, Rebounds, Assists, and Steals as a ROOKIE
MJ: Yes
LBJ: No (Boozer lead Cavs' rebounding during LBJ's rookie year)

• 3000 pts, 200 Steals, and 100 blocks in a season
MJ: 1 (1986-87), all-time record
LBJ: 0

• Seasons with 2500 pts, 500 rebounds, and 500 assists
MJ: 2 (1986-87, 1987-88), all-time record
LBJ: 0

• Seasons with 200 steals and 100 blocks
MJ: 2 (all-time record)
LBJ: 0

• Seasons with 1500 Pts., 300 assists, 100 steals prior to All-Star break
MJ: 3 (1987-'88, 1988-'89, 1989-'90)
LBJ: 0

• Consecutive Games with 10+ Pts for the first 13 seasons
MJ: 866 (all-time record for 13 seasons)
LBJ: 691

• 50 pt. Games while shooting 80% from the field
MJ: 1 (Nov. 16, 1988)
LBJ: None

• Games played to reach 25,000 Points
MJ: 782
LBJ: 915

• Consecutive Games with Triple-Doubles
MJ: 7 (10 in 11 straight games)
LBJ: 4

• Fastest time to achieve triple-double in a game
MJ: 21 minutes (March 1989)
LBJ: 32 minutes (Feb. 2013)

• Most points averaged in Playoffs
MJ: 43.7 (1986)
LBJ: 35.3 (2009)

• Most Points Averaged in a Final Series
MJ: 41.0 (1993, 1st All-time)
LBJ: 35.8 (2015)

• Lowest Points Averaged in a Final Series
MJ: 27.3 (1996)
LBJ: 17.8 (2011)

• Lowest points scored in a Finals Game
MJ: 22 (1996)
LBJ: 8 (2011)

• Most Assists averaged in a Finals Series
MJ: 11.4 (1991) - record for a non-point guard. Only him and Magic Johnson averaged more APG in a Finals series.
LBJ: 10 (2017)

• Missed 300 shots in a playoff run
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (2015)

• Most times leading the playoffs in points per game
MJ: 10
LBJ: 3

• Most times leading the playoffs in total points
MJ: 8
LBJ: 6

• Number of NBA Finals shooting over 40% from the 3pt line
MJ: 2 (1992, 1993)
LBJ: 1 (2014)

• Number of NBA Finals shooting BELOW 30% from the 3pt line
MJ: None
LBJ: 2 (2007, 2012)

• Number of NBA Finals scoring & assisting 50% of team points
MJ: 3 (1991, 1993, 1997)
LBJ: 2 (2015, 2018)

• Playoff TITLE RUNS shooting over 38% from the 3pt line
MJ: 3 (1991, 1992, 1993)
LBJ: 0

• Win-Loss Record and Titles during the First 100 Playoffs Games
MJ: 61-39, 2 Titles
LBJ: 60-40, 0 Titles

• Pts. per Game, FG%, 3-PT FG%, and NBA Titles during the First 141 Playoffs Games
MJ: 34.0, 50%, 36%, 4
LBJ: 28.1, 47%, 32%, 2

• 60-win teams beaten in the Playoffs during TITLE SEASONS
MJ: 7 (most by one NBA dynasty in a decade)
LBJ: 1

• Faced elimination in the Finals
MJ: No
LBJ: 11x

• Swept in the Finals
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (twice)

• Went to Game 7 in the Finals
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (even against a depleted team, e.g. 2016 Warriors)

• Highest Losing Point Differential in a Final Series
MJ: None
LBJ: 14.0 PPG (2014 loss vs Spurs) - the largest in NBA Finals history

• Lost playoff series with home court advantage
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (2009, 2010, 2011)

• Won NBA Title as the ONLY ALL-STAR of his team on the same season
MJ: Yes (1991)
LBJ: No

• 10 Straight Playoffs Appearance since ROOKIE SEASON
MJ: Yes
LBJ: No (missed playoffs during first 2 years)

• All-Star Game Starter as a Rookie
MJ: Yes
LBJ: No

• Best Team Win-Loss Record
MJ: 72-10 (1996)
LBJ: 66-16 (2009)

• Total Finals Win-Loss Record
MJ: 24-11 (68.57%)
LBJ: 18-31 (36.7%)

• Game Winner/Tying Shots in the Regular Season under 24 sec. in the 4th quarter/overtime
MJ: 33 of 58 attempts (56.9%)
LBJ: 36 of 119 attempts (30.3%)

• Game Winner/Tying Shots in the Playoffs under 24 sec. in the 4th quarter/overtime
MJ: 9 of 18 attempts (50%)
LBJ: 10 of 27 attempts (37%)

• Game winning/tying shots in the Finals under 30 seconds:
MJ: 4 of 8 attempts (50%)
* 1991 Finals Game 3 - Game tying shot to force OT
* 1997 Finals Game 1 - Buzzer beater over Russell
* 1997 Finals Game 5 - Go-ahead 3 with 25 seconds
* 1998 Finals Game 6 - Championship winning steal and shot
LBJ: 0 of 6 attempts (0%)
* missed game tying shot in Game 3 of 2007 Finals
* missed game tying shot in Game 6 of 2013 Finals
* missed game winner in Game 1 of 2015 Finals
* missed game winner in Game 2 of 2015 Finals in the 4th quarter
* missed game winner in Game 2 of 2015 Finals in OT
* missed game-tying 3 pt. shot from 23 ft. in Game 3 of 2017 finals (swat by Andre Iguodala)

• Outscored/Outplayed by a bench player in the Finals
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (Jason Terry, 2011)

• Outplayed by a 13PPG player 3 straight games in the Finals
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (Kawhi Leonard - Games 3-4-5, 2014)

• Hall of Fame Centers beaten in the playoffs
MJ: Ewing (x5), Mourning (x3), Mutombo, Shaq
LBJ: No one is inducted yet

• Notable Big Men blocked
MJ: Ewing, Shaq, Kevin Willis, Antoine Carr, Tim Duncan
LBJ: Thiago Splitter, Tim Duncan (at 37 years old), Garnett (at 35 years old), Yao (from behind - a blind side)

• Lost in the Olympics
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (2004, settled for Bronze)

• Age during first Olympic Gold Medal
MJ: 21 (1984)
LBJ: 23 (2008)

• Lost other International Competition
MJ: No
LBJ: Yes (2006 FIBA World, settled for Bronze)

• Height and Position
MJ: 6'6" Shooting Guard
LBJ: 6'8" Small Forward

• Highest Recorded Vertical
MJ: 48 inches
LBJ: 44 inches

- - - - - - - -

FIRST 13 SEASONS:
(MJ as a Bulls player vs LBJ)

• Finals Games with minimum of 35pts/5reb/5assists
MJ: 7 of 35 games
LBJ: 6 of 40 games

• Playoff games with minimum of 35pts/5reb/5assists
MJ: 34
LBJ: 27

• Playoff games with minimum of 40pts/5reb/5assists
MJ: 17
LBJ: 15

• Playoff games with minimum of 45pts/5reb/5assists
MJ: 10
LBJ: 6

• Playoff games with minimum of 50pts./5reb/5assists
MJ: 2
LBJ: 0

• Playoff games with minimum of 55pts/5reb/5assists
MJ: 2
LBJ: 0

• Playoff games with minimum of 60pts/5reb/5assists
MJ: 1
LBJ: 0

 

[D241]

Jordan has:

•3 more rings
•3 more final mvps
•1 more DPOY
•1 more season MVP
•9 more scoring titles
•3 more steals leader
•3 more all defensive team selections
•4000 more points / bron moved past him in playoff points, but it took him longer.
•800 more steals
•Beat 20 50+ win teams in the playoffs (Lebron only defeated 10)
•Jordan never averaged less than 40% Field Goal in the finals
Lebron did it twice
•6/6 (never allowed a game 7)
•Jordan never had a teammate averaged more than 22 points in the finals..
Kyrie averaged over 28 and DWade averaged more than 26
•MJ had more points in the playoffs in less games..
All of this accomplished in 13 seasons
•Michael Jordan in the playoffs has put up atleast 40ppg, 5rpg, 5apg in 6 different playoff series. Along with an average of about 55% shooting, 3spg and 2bpg.
(86 vs bos, 89 vs cavs, 90 vs philly, 92 vs Miami, 93 vs Phoenix, 88 vs cavs) Jordan won every one of those matchups except for the 1986 matchup vs the celtics.
•Jordan in 88-89 averaged 32ppg, 8apg, 8rpg, 3spg off 54% shooting. LeBron has never even came close to this stat line.
•in 87 thru 92, MJ averaged 5 straight seasons of atleast 51% FG shooting. LeBron has never done this.
•the lowest FT% MJ ever shot in a season was 78%. Lebrons highest in a season ever is 78%.
•MJ has a higher playoff FG% of 48.7% to Lebrons 48.3%
•MJ has a higher playoff player efficiency rating of 28.6 to Lebrons 27.3.
•MJ shoots a higher playoff 3 point percentage of 33.2% to Lebrons 32.9%

•MJ also shocked the league by being the first (and only) player to have 100 blocks and 200 steals in the same season, then turned around and did it again the next year..

-10 STRAIGHT scoring titles

In 89 Jordan won the scoring title all star MVP slam dunk title regular season MVP and Defensive Player of The Year. Jordan also averaged 41 pts a game for an entire Finals shooting 50% and won. Something LBJ has never done.

 

[member 1013]

I heard kawhi Leonard was good