General Russia Ukraine round 2 Price hike boogaloo

[MMAHAWK]

im not sure about that. americans die of starvation every day due to poverty

with the ruble taking such a big hit, id imagine that a lot of russians are going to die of starvation and other health issues

Apparently 9 million were on the brink of starvation 8 months before the war started.

UN: Hundreds of thousands of Russians on verge of starvation

More than 9 million Russians live in conditions of food shortage or malnutrition, according to the UNICEF report “The State of Food Security and Nutrition in the World 2021”. According to the organization, which is part of the UN, in 2018-20, 400 thousand Russian citizens were in the group of...

www.uawire.org

 

[NotBanjaxo]

im not sure about that. americans die of starvation every day due to poverty

with the ruble taking such a big hit, id imagine that a lot of russians are going to die of starvation and other health issues

That's just supply side. We've also created hyper inflation by devaluing their currency. So when you used to be able to buy a jug of milk for 4 rubles, you might not be able to now that it's 8. Also, keep in mind that were a couple weeks in and have countless examples of what happens when sanctions are introduced.

I concede the point, I was thinking solely of supply. Surely the benevolent leader of Russia wouldn't let his populace starve though? There's no precedent for that happening there. /s

The only ways that the war will end with Ukraine not being subjugated by Russia are defeat / collapse of the Russian military, or from internal pressure within Russia (or a combination of partial military collapse and internal rumblings).

It's a shitty situation for civilians in both countries, but Russia is the aggressor and Ukranians are suffering far far worse right now.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

I concede the point, I was thinking solely of supply. Surely the benevolent leader of Russia wouldn't let his populace starve though? There's no precedent for that happening there. /s

The only ways that the war will end with Ukraine not being subjugated by Russia are defeat / collapse of the Russian military, or from internal pressure within Russia (or a combination of partial military collapse and internal rumblings).

It's a shitty situation for civilians in both countries, but Russia is the aggressor and Ukranians are suffering far far worse right now.

I mean we could probably try mediating a negotiation instead of just dumping more and more weapons into Ukraine and hammering the Russian populace with sanctions.

 

[NotBanjaxo]

I mean we could probably try mediating a negotiation instead of just dumping more and more weapons into Ukraine and hammering the Russian populace with sanctions.

Have you seen the Russian "negotiation" position?

It started out as basically "surrender and we'll stop killing you", and has recently evolved to "give us the Donbas, agree that we own Crimea, and give up your weapons".

If Russia are ever going to be brought round to a negotiating position that isn't obviously never going to fly, pressure needs to be applied. Hence the weapon deliveries and sanctions.

Do you really think that this could be resolved purely by negotiations? I don't.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

Have you seen the Russian "negotiation" position?

It started out as basically "surrender and we'll stop killing you", and has recently evolved to "give us the Donbas, agree that we own Crimea, and give up your weapons".

If Russia are ever going to be brought round to a negotiating position that isn't obviously never going to fly, pressure needs to be applied. Hence the weapon deliveries and sanctions.

Do you really think that this could be resolved purely by negotiations? I don't.

You left out NATO, but those have been the Russian demands since before the invasion began. Could it be resolved through negotiations? I have no idea but maybe we should at least try.

 

[NotBanjaxo]

You left out NATO, but those have been the Russian demands since before the invasion began.

Zelensky has already announced that he would concede, and rule out joining NATO.

 

[NotBanjaxo]

ould it be resolved through negotiations? I have no idea but maybe we should at least try.

There's only one form of "negotiation" that Putin will understand. One that is forced upon him through strength, not one that is begged for from a position of weakness.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

Zelensky has already announced that he would concede, and rule out joining NATO.

Then we're getting close.

 

[La Paix]

Have you seen the Russian "negotiation" position?

It started out as basically "surrender and we'll stop killing you", and has recently evolved to "give us the Donbas, agree that we own Crimea, and give up your weapons".

If Russia are ever going to be brought round to a negotiating position that isn't obviously never going to fly, pressure needs to be applied. Hence the weapon deliveries and sanctions.

Do you really think that this could be resolved purely by negotiations? I don't.

Putin hasn’t shown any desire for what most people consider negotiations. It’s seems our best hope is somebody within the Kremlin challenging him or Putin catching AIDS or the Rona.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

There's only one form of "negotiation" that Putin will understand. One that is forced upon him through strength, not one that is begged for from a position of weakness.

and you're willing to partake in everything that comes along with that? Because I'm not.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

Putin hasn’t shown any desire for what most people consider negotiations. It’s seems our best hope is somebody within the Kremlin challenging him or Putin catching AIDS or the Rona.

He's vaccinated. So we're down to AIDS.

 

[NotBanjaxo]

Then we're getting close.

Nope, still a long way off.

Russia will not get Ukraine to disarm without conquering them, and I very much doubt that Ukraine will concede territory unless they are at least half conquered. We're unfortunately a long way off yet IMO.

 

[kaladin stormblessed]

Zelensky has already announced that he would concede, and rule out joining NATO.

thats a good point. Zelensky ruled out joining NATO befooooooore the Russian invasion even began

Putin is a lying piece of shit. he was going to invade regardless

 

[NotBanjaxo]

and you're willing to partake in everything that comes along with that? Because I'm not.

"Willing to partake"?

You act like Ukraine somehow activated a magnet and dragged thousands of Russian armoured vehicles and artillery pieces into their country against their will.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

Nope, still a long way off.

Russia will not get Ukraine to disarm without conquering them, and I very much doubt that Ukraine will concede territory unless they are at least half conquered. We're unfortunately a long way off yet IMO.

I think of Ukraine concedes the territory and stocks with not getting into NATO and we stop arming them after the conflict Russia would concede the disarmament part.

 

[La Paix]

View: https://twitter.com/russianembassy/status/1504780226806624272?s=21

 

[NotBanjaxo]

I think of Ukraine concedes the territory and stocks with not getting into NATO and we stop arming them after the conflict Russia would concede the disarmament part.

Well whoop de fucking do.

The result of that is Putin gets what he wants by invading and killing thousands.

great deterrent, I'm sure he wouldn't consider trying that again.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

"Willing to partake"?

You act like Ukraine somehow activated a magnet and dragged thousands of Russian armoured vehicles and artillery pieces into their country against their will.

No, I definitely don't act like that. You said Putin will only stop if he's forced through strength. That means we go to war, unless you meant something else by that statement?

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

Well whoop de fucking do.

The result of that is Putin gets what he wants by invading and killing thousands.

great deterrent, I'm sure he wouldn't consider trying that again.

Those places had referendums to leave Ukraine and join Russia.

 

[La Paix]

View: https://twitter.com/liveuamap/status/1504850467611975682?s=21

 

[NotBanjaxo]

No, I definitely don't act like that. You said Putin will only stop if he's forced through strength. That means we go to war, unless you meant something else by that statement?

I was responding to your ridiculous position that we should stop supplying weapons, stop sanctions and then try to negotiate.

Read back through the conversation.

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

thats a good point. Zelensky ruled out joining NATO befooooooore the Russian invasion even began

Putin is a lying piece of shit. he was going to invade regardless

Zelensky should have told NATO that.

 

[NotBanjaxo]

Those places had referendums to leave Ukraine and join Russia.

Bits of countries don't just get to decide who they belong to independently, that's not how things have ever worked.

Crimea and Donbass are Putin's Sudatenland (I know you love a good Hitler analogy).

 

[BeardOfKnowledge]

I was responding to your ridiculous position that we should stop supplying weapons, stop sanctions and then try to negotiate.

Read back through the conversation.

Not wanting people to die is the ridiculous position to hold? You can't be serious.

 

[kaladin stormblessed]

Zelensky should have told NATO that.

we are going to have to agree to disagree on this one. i dont think its Putins right to say whether or not Ukraine gets to join NATO in the first place

i understand that, in theory, the fear of that led to russia invading, but Ukraine is a free country to do as it pleases

putin can fuck right off